News

With the Canadian dollar at 30-year highs despite some slippage last week, are you heading south of the border to shop?

Do you think there are bargains in America? Do you need a regular Target fix? Or are you worried about Canada's economy, so you stay home to spend your cash? In fact, do you think all this conspicuous consumption is just bad for the planet?

Earlier today, the Globe and Mail shoppers who headed across the U.S. border last week — Leslie Shepherd, Patrick Brethour, Caroline Alphonso and Christine Diemert — shared their shopping stories. Your questions and their replies appear at the bottom of this page.

Ms. Shepherd, who has tested her shopping skills while living in several countries around the world, is Political Editor and Deputy National Editor of The Globe.

Mr. Brethour, a neophyte shopper with an sharp eye for detail, is the Bureau Chief of the Globe's Vancouver bureau.

Ms. Alphonso, by far the most frugal of the bunch, returned from a shopping day in Buffalo last week with two new books. She is a general assignment reporter for The Globe.

Ms. Diemert enjoys comparing prices, but in the end can't avoid the attraction of a U.S. shopping trip for the chance to buy cheese in a can and stop for lunch at the International House of Pancakes. She's managing editor (news), of globeandmail.com.

Editor's Note: globeandmail.com editors will read and allow or reject each question/comment. Comments/questions may be edited for length or clarity. We will not publish questions/comments that include personal attacks on participants in these discussions, that make false or unsubstantiated allegations, that purport to quote people or reports where the purported quote or fact cannot be easily verified, or questions/comments that include vulgar language or libellous statements. Preference will be given to readers who submit questions/comments using their full name and home town, rather than a pseudonym.

Christine Diemert, globeandmail.com: Thanks to everyone for joining us today.

A lot has changed in cross-border shopping since peer pressure had me heading to Buffalo in search of the Levis Red Tab, boot cut with the button fly. For one thing, you can now find Gap stores in just about every mall in most Canadian cities. And, the Canadian dollar is no longer worth more than the U.S. dollar. (I'll try to find a prize for anyone who can figure out just how many years ago that was.) So I'll start out by saying that while I'm not against cross-border shopping — I enjoy a good shopping afternoon while on a holiday in the U.S. — I do find the idea of driving hundreds of kilometres in search of a bargain rather decadent.

Leslie Shepherd, The Globe and Mail: Chris, I think you hit the nail on the head: Know your prices before you go shopping south of the border.

You'll spend more in gas, time and aggravation waiting at the border than you would save on many items such as iPods or Game Boys.

But if you're looking for a lot of items — thinking back-to-school or Christmas shopping or just a good old-fashioned power-shopping extravaganza — or you can combine shopping with a vacation or visit to friends or relatives, then it makes more sense.

Christine Diemert, globeandmail.com: We developed an excellent calculator which is linked to this story that gives an insight into how much items really cost if you factor in gas, mileage, etc. The one thing we didn't include was time. I think too many of us don't quantify our time. You might want to consider adding $20 for every hour you spend. (That's a very conservative estimate of course.)

Patrick Brethour, Globe and Mail Vancouver bureau: It may be hundreds of kilometres for Canadians in the East, but here on the West Coast, we need to drive only about an hour (excluding what could be a lengthy wait at the border) to get to those bargains! To me, it looks like there are two kinds of cross-border shoppers: the vacationers and quick-trippers, that pop down to buy some clothing; and the heavy-duty savers, who are looking to save hundreds, even thousands, on big-ticket items such as refrigerators or cars.

Jeff Wiggins, Toronto: With the rising dollar, my wife and I are looking at more shopping down south. It's a lot cheaper to travel as well. The biggest change is considering whether to purchase a new car in the U.S. It appears that more people are considering this as car prices have not come down in Canada. Their is a lot of confusion around which car companies honour a NA warranty. Does a proper listing exist?

There is an excellent website which describes the process to import a car new or used http://www.riv.ca/english/html/how_to_import.html

Two Cents, Toronto: I would love for the G&M to write an article about buying cars in the U.S. for use in Canada. I would love to buy a car across the border but I don't quite know the rules on bringing it back here.

D. Spackman, Calgary: What about purchasing a vehicle in the US and bringing it back? My son was told by a dealership here that as soon as you register here in Canada a car that you bought in the U.S., the warranty is void. That seems to be contrary to at least the spirit of NAFTA.

Christine Diemert, globeandmail.com: I'm not an expert on buying cars in the U.S. But, even more than in Canada, it is something that needs to be done after some research.

Thanks for sending that URL Jeff and I'll add another few, with the qualifier that I am not endorsing them, just sharing.

http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/mj/import.htm

http://www.riv.ca/english/US_vehicle_admissibility.pdf

http://www.auto-broker-magic.com/Canada_Import.html

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20070710.RAUTOS10/TPStory/?query=keenan+and+cars+and+U.S.

Leslie Shepherd, The Globe and Mail: To Two Cents, we specifically didn't mention cars because one of the other sections in The Globe is planning an article on that aspect of cross-border shopping.

For me, the price would have to be way lower, multiple thousands and thousands, for me to want to import a car from the states. My family moved back to Canada in 2005 after living in the U.S. for many years and the paperwork involved in bringing in two cars was enormous. Plus we had to pay duty. Then you have to get it checked by provincial authorities to make sure the car meets all the Candian standards, like having a bilingual label on your air bag . . .

I'd love to hear what other people's threshold is — when are the savings big enough to make the hassle worthwhile?

Donna Reichert, Edmonton: I noticed that Ms. Alphonso bought two books while in the States. Why is it that we are not getting the benefit of our high dollar when it comes to books? Their prices have not changed in our book stores.

Leslie Shepherd, The Globe and Mail: Good question. I was at a birthday party yesterday and many people were asking that very question. I think that's one of the first places where Canadian retailers are going to have to lower prices. I spent about $100 at Borders in Buffalo without breaking a sweat. It wasn't just prices. It was selection.

My son reads the Japanese anime graphic books (think paperback comic books that you read back to front). First of all, they're $7.95 at Borders compared to $10.95 or more in Canada. Not a savings worth making the trip for, but did I pick up three while I was there? You bet.

But the other pleasant surprise was the selection. There are 26 (or so) books in the Dragon-Ball 7 series. When I go into my local Chapters, they have maybe 12-15 of them at any time. Borders had all 26 so I was able to pick up almost every volume my son was missing.

While I was there I also bought a Harry Potter checkers game that he will give to a classmate as a birthday gift next week and I got a Harry Potter chess set to put aside for him for Christmas. I haven't seen either of those items in the current round of Harry Potter stuff in Canada.

Christine Diemert, globeandmail.com: He's not inclined to read the online chats is he Leslie?

Leslie Shepherd, The Globe and Mail: No problem.

Caroline Alphonso, The Globe and Mail: Hi, Donna. My husband had been searching Canadian bookstores for a Philip Caputo book for a few months now. But every bookstore we checked didn't seem to have it. I stopped in at the Borders bookstore in Buffalo and there is was! Let's just say it made my husband's day. And since I just happened to be there, I got the new Harry Potter book for a whopping 40% off. A much better deal than here in Canada.

As to your question, I believe that books are priced a certain way in the Canadian market at the beginning of the year and these prices tend to move infrequently. Also, it wasn't too long ago that equation worked in Canadians' favour.

Le Malbadon:

For example, if you brought back 5 litres of liquor instead of the 1.5 allowed for a 7-day visit, what is charged?

The only thing online I could find was Canada Customs saying you would have to check with your provincial liquor control board, but (for example Alberta) I can't find even a single mention of customs charges on the AGLC website. You would think this would be something they would commonly address enough that they would post it somewhere......

Patrick Brethour, Globe and Mail Vancouver Bureau: Generally speaking, there aren't duties on goods manufactured in the NAFTA countries of Canada, the United States and Mexico. Beyond that, it really depends on the specific item you're purchasing.

For instance, you wouldn't pay a duty on a microwave, wherever it was made. However, there are duties on other kinds of kitchen appliances. As for liquor, the duties and other levies can be steep. A 1.5-litre bottle of wine was on sale for $9.75 in Bellingham, Wash., including taxes. Accounting for the exchange rate, that tab edged up to $10.41, less than half of the price in B.C. But duties and other fees would add $12 to the total, according to Canadian customs officials. That leaves any would-be wine bargain-hunter with just over $3 in savings — hardly eye popping.

The Border Information Service number, 1-800-461-9999 within Canada, provides automated responses, and during business hours, there are you can run your duty questions past an agent.

Christine Diemert, globeandmail.com: Patrick, that's an excellent number to point out. People should make sure they know what they are getting into before trying to cross back into Canada. I find generally, playing ignorant doesn't seem to fly at the border. I'm sure the woman beside us in the duty payment area at the border would agree. As we were leaving the border, customs officers were about to check every item in her car against the bills she tried to show as she crossed. Bad move.

Sonia T., Toronto: Are there good deals in low end, medium end, and high end products?

Could you put a percentage on these? Is the quality better then what we have in Canada?

Leslie Shepherd, The Globe and Mail: Lots of deals on the high end.

We didn't have room to include all our price checks in Saturday, but a 750ml bottle of Veuve Clicquot Ponsardin champagne cost $49.99 US at The Wine Sellar in Cheektowaga, N.Y., and $84.95 Canadian at the LCBO. A Kitchen Aid, 24.8 cubic feet fridge (stainless steel with chest freezer) was $2,099.99 at Sears at the Walden Galleria in Buffalo and $2,899.99 in Canada.

Now, I'm not sure how many people are bringing fridges across the border …. We also found big differences in prices for big flatscreen TVs. Again, transportation would be an issue. Not likely to fit in the trunk.

Ice cream also a big bargain in the States. Might not make it home unless you travel with a cooler and ice like I do, so maybe you just want to pack some plastic spoons and pass it around the car. It will give you something to do while waiting in the long lines at the border.

Christine Diemert, globeandmail.com: I'll just add that I'm not nearly as interested in the big items as I am the double, triple discounted items in nice clothing stores. I got a skirt and summer sweater on sale at an Ann Taylor in Miami recently for $13 US -- both items. I felt that was nearly free.

Michael Snider, Technology Editor, The Globe: C'mon guys, join the 21st Century. Many of the hot shopping destinations Canadians visit have these things called websites where you can order merchandise -- just sitting there in front of a computer! And then, get this, they even mail it to you.

OK, so some of them don't ship to Canada, but why would you want to shop at Target when you have L.L. Bean? And you save on gas and hotel. Up the Internet!

Christine Diemert, globeandmail.com: Good point, Michael, and I'm inclined to agree. However, a real Target store, and especially just about any large American grocery store, holds a particular fascination for me. Rather like the consumer equivalent of eco-tourism.

That has less to do with actual shopping however.

Brian Lowry: I have lived near the border (Toronto and Fredericton, and on the other side, Ithaca, N.Y.) for most of my 42 years, and I'm always amazed that so many Canadians still cluster so close to it when cross-border shopping.

Don't people realize that they only catch the barest glimpse in the near-to-the-border malls of Watertown (N.Y.), Bellingham (Wash.), and Bangor (Maine)? Torontonians are sort of stuck with Buffalo, and Montrealers have an embarrassment of choices, but Seattle, Syracuse (N.Y.), and Portland (Maine) have far better (and more mainstream U.S.) shopping than the tiny towns and cities which seem to boast the most Canadian shoppers.

Sorry for venting, but The Globe's recent article on this very heavily emphasized just-across-the-border shopping.

Leslie Shepherd, The Globe and Mail: We picked the U.S. border cities where most Canadians shop. That was part of the point, to show what you could get by turning off the Interstate and just walking into the nearest store. We didn't hunt around to find the best bargains, just what was on offer that day, what the average shopper would see.

Having grown up in Vancouver and attended university in Washington, I can't say that I found the shopping any better at the Northgate or Southgate Malls in Seattle than at the Bellis Fair Mall in Bellingham.

I'd be interested to hear more about the differences you have found. I found that from Vancouver, I would pop down to Bellingham on a whim, just to see what they might have. Seattle is an all-day commitment. And of course with gas prices being what they are now, I'd probably think more seriously about either trip unless I had a lot of shopping to do.

Nancy King, Toronto: What is the formula to compare gasoline prices here to those in the U.S.?

Patrick Brethour, Globe and Mail Vancouver Bureau: Nancy, gasoline prices are one of those products that do seem to be responding quickly to the exchange rate. I bought gasoline on the same day in Bellingham and Vancouver, and the U.S. price was about 16 per cent lower than the pump price in Canada. That sounds like quite a gap, except that Canadian gasoline taxes are higher than in the U.S., so the price the retailer is charging is much closer than the final bill makes it seem.

We had a story a couple of weeks ago pointing out that gasoline prices are falling fastest in those parts of Canada closest to the border.

The formula is simple enough: divide the U.S. price by 3.79, which will give you the price in U.S. $ per litre. Then, multiply that number by the current exchange rate, with today's being $1.0681. So, a pump price of $3.099 (U.S.) a gallon would be 81.8 cents (U.S.) a litre, or 87.4 cents a litre in Canadian dollars.

Patrick Brethour: You're welcome! Canadians may start cross-border shopping because of the prices, but I think the level of service and selection in U.S. stores will draw them back. Matching that experience will, I think, be an even bigger challenge for Canadian retailers.

Pamela Labelle, Toronto: I have been cross-border shopping regularly even when our dollar was at its lowest ebb because my shopping trips are not motivated by price, but rather, by the vastly superior selection — particularly in specialty sized garments — that is available in the U.S.

Additionally the customer service I've experienced in U.S. department stores — and not just the high end retailers — is something that management at the Bay and Sears Canada and even Holts should aspire to. I think that these are two more compelling reasons that many Canadians will now make shopping trips into the U.S.

Leslie Shepherd, The Globe and Mail: Customer service varies from place to place I think. I used to rant about the curse of full employment in suburban Washington, D.C. The economy was so hot for a time that stores had a tough time finding sales people, never mind qualified sales staff.

But yes, selection/availability does seem to be better down south and that is one of the big draws.

Christine Diemert, globeandmail.com: Customer service certainly is an issue on either side of the border.

One of the things I always enjoy about shopping in the U.S. is the that clerks in stores are generally quite cheerful. And yes, even in Manhattan. In fact, I find shopping banter kind of fun. In some places — Philadelphia is one of my favourite spots — there is some point when other shoppers become engaged in the chatter.

I've tried that in Canada, doesn't work. Turns out it doesn't work in Buffalo either.

Caroline Alphonso: Hello, Pamela. A lot of Canadians I spoke with in Buffalo said the same thing: More selection there than in Canada. I have been to Buffalo twice this year, and all I came out with is two books. That probably speaks volumes about my shopping habits. I know my colleagues have come away with a lot more. I've heard that toys and children's clothes are a better deal in the U.S. As for the customer service, I think it's similar on both sides of the border.

Ram Krishan, Windsor, Ont.: Not long ago, one of our MPs wanted to make sure that "ladies" pay the same price for hair cut as "men" do. Can not we have a law that can enforce the manufacturers to have a reasonable price for the goods? That means if they sell it for $100 US, it should be about 5% higher in Canada. By the way, selling cost are much lower in Canada due to lower wages and cheaper rents.

On the other hand, Dubai, Qatar, Singapore etc. are becoming retail heavens, why can not Canada become a retail heaven for U.S. shoppers if prices are right irrespective of exchange rates?

Patrick Brethour:

Canada's experience with price and wage controls in the 1970s (not to mention the economic implosion of the former Soviet Union) demonstrate rather convincingly that short-circuiting the price mechanism of a free-market economy doesn't solve anything. The same maxim holds for retailers. Over time, the free market should push prices in Canada downward if consumers in Canada shift their purchases south of the border.

In any case, some companies are already gearing up to take advantage of the rise in the Canadian dollar — one major retailer is looking at launching a Canada-U.S. catalogue with a single set of prices. As for costs, some U.S. rents may be higher, but Canadian retailers do have higher transportation costs, and more important, they don't enjoy the economies of scale that come from selling into a market of 300-million-plus people.

Nick Adams, Napanee, Ont.: My wife and I would like to visit the States for a day of shopping. She is not a Canadian citizen but has a Canadian permanent resident card. Does she need a visa to cross the border? Also, my passport has expired. Do I need a valid passport to enter the States by car? Thanks

Leslie Shepherd: Best check with U.S. immigration authorities — rules vary depending on what country you are from. You don't need a passport to cross the border by car now, but you probably will by next summer. You do need a government-issued identification document, such as a driver's licence with a photograph, plus a birth certificate or other proof of citizenship. A passport is so much easier, though, so you may want to go stand in that line soon.

Dale L.: Hi. We are travelling to the U.S. in August. Where can a person find info on what products are definitely more advantageous to purchase in the U.S. as compared to Canada? Please advise of any websites, books, lists etc. that may help us out. Regards. Bargain Shopping Family

Leslie Shepherd: The major U.S. stores all have websites with prices. But you can also get a general idea of what book prices are by poking around amazon.com, for example, or electronics prices by looking at Best Buy's U.S. site. Do some price checking before you leave home. But in general, you're going to find better deals on clothes, shoes, books, and alcohol.

Steve Acken: Hi Leslie, Patrick, Christine, and Caroline. I'm following the current conversation online at .com and read Saturday's "Soaring Loonie" story (I work for eBay Canada's PR agency and didn't want to influence the conversation in any way). I wanted to introduce the notion that a rise in the loonie could also increase virtual cross-border shopping on sites like eBay, where Canadians might be more inclined to buy from U.S. sellers more than ever given the dollar rise.

In addition, I noticed a reader comment about Canadians buying cars in the U.S., and thought you might be interested to know that a Canadian buys a vehicle every 12 minutes on the eBay Motors site (many of these are U.S. vehicles that are both attractive in price and have not experienced a Canadian winter which proves to be big differentiator to many buyers).

Christine Diemert writes: Hi, Steve, and thanks for following the discussion.

Jennifer Ellis, Barrie, Ont.: What department of Target (e.g. books, children's clothing, linens, etc.) would a Canadian shopper find the best bargains in? Thanks.

Leslie Shepherd: Target is good for kids clothes and linens. I bought a bathing suit for my son for $10.99, two fun T-shirts with funny drawings about life revolving around computer games for $7.99 each (similar T-shirts would be at least double in Toronto), and a five-pack of boys underwear for $5.79.

They had a great sale the day we were there on sheet sets -- queen size, 100 per cent cotton, 1 flat sheet, 1 fitted, 220 threat count for $19.99.

Wal-Mart or JC Penny may have had just as good deals. It just happened that Target was our first stop of the day. I also stocked up on ketchup at Target — Canadian ketchup is too sweet. It was $2.14 U.S. a bottle vs. $3.99 Canadian at Loblaws in downtown Toronto, but price wasn't an issue in this case. I'd have bought it even if it were more expensive.

H.B., Halifax: What bothers me is that I can't find pants like Columbia or Haggar with a 34' inseam in Halifax, but stores in small towns in Maine and NH have them. Also, why do the same products (deodorant, shaving gel, creams, lotions, etc) in a U.S. Wal-Mart cost half of what they do in Canada? In addition we get stung with 14% tax, in NH it's 0%.

Leslie Shepherd: Selection is one of the attractions of shopping south, for sure. I was also struck by how neatly clothing was displayed in the stores in Buffalo.

I find it very frustrating taking my 10-year-old son on the twice-a-year clothes shopping excursions (although not as frustrating as he finds it ….). When you go into the big department stores in the Toronto suburbs, the kids' clothing departments often look like, well, a bunch of kids have just run through them. Everything is all mixed up, you can't find the size you want, then they are out of Size 10 boys jeans in any styles …. I wind up going to the speciality kids' shops and paying more because I can find what I want.

So how can a Target in suburban Buffalo keep its stock tidy so you can quickly find what you want, and we can't?

Doug Morris, Welland, Ont.: We shop in Buffalo quite often. My father is in a senior's home and requires incontinence products. The cost at Target $8.61 US ($9.20 Can.). The cheapest cost in Ont. $13.86 Can. Another example is sale items. Lord and Taylor summer items reduced already 50% then take another 40% off lowest ticketed amount. I bought a $66 Ashworth golf shirt for $19.80. The sales items are all top brands with a large selection — not stock from last year. Even considering the cost of gas to go there and the toll at the bridge, it still makes it worthwhile and it was so even when the Canadian dollar differential was $.20-$.25.

Leslie Shepherd: The sales do seem better in the States, or is that just the grass looking greener on the other side? I was at Vaughan Mills, a big mall north of Toronto, on Saturday and they had some pretty fine sales — including 40 or 50 per cent off already reduced items at the Disney Store. Coles book store had a deal where if you bought three paperbacks, you got the fourth one free.

One of the things I miss most about living in the States is the use of coupons. Every week, you would get coupons in the mail for $5 off or 20 per cent off goods at Linen and Things and Bed, Bath and Beyond. And grocery stores routinely doubled the value of grocery coupons — you could wind up getting money back from the store if ketchup were on sale and you had a coupon that was doubled.

Christine Diemert, globeandmail.com: I'm closing the discussion now as we've gone over our time. I'd like to thank Patrick, Leslie and Caroline for joining us today.