Skip navigation

 Login or Register | Member Centre

Vimy Ridge: The making of a myth

MICHAEL VALPY

From Saturday's Globe and Mail

Latest comment posted at 2:21 AM EDT 07/04/07

The victory at Vimy has become inseparable from the Canadian identity. But how it got that status is a murkier matter, and a more interesting one, which Michael Valpy explains ...Read the full article

This conversation is semi-moderated What is moderation? | How do I report a comment?

  1. Michael Sharp from Daffodil City, Canada writes:

    On an international stage Canada achieved what no other nation had up to that point.

    It's a shame that WW1 cost us 67,000 lives, but gave us our national identity.

    It would have been so much more civilized to have received international recognition as the purveyors of the World's Best Maple Syrup.

    Alas.
  2. Dana Cruickshank from Canada writes: What this article is saying is very true, but I don't think it is the whole truth.

    The tone of this article means to say that Vimy was a pointless battle and was useless.

    Canada, along with many other countries, has its own myths on why we are better than anyone else. Whether it be the Charge of the Light Brigade or perhaps the peacekeeping myth for Canada (a myth that I think was alluded to in this article)

    Canada has two very seperate identities built on myths. Those who want to get out of Afghanistan allude to peacekeeping all the time. while those who want to stay sometimes use Vimy Ridge.

    They are both myths in their own way.
    And I personally think that the author of this article is trying to say something about what we as Canadians should be doing presently. Vimy Ridge did not have a great impact on the outcome of the war, but at the time it was being fought, the young men fighting up the slope did not know that. The battle was a brilliant tactical victory for Canada, and did not affect the outcome of the war because the British failed to push the Germans back to the south of Vimy.

    It should also be noted that both the British and French tried to take the Ridge but failed.

    I'm not saying Vimy Ridge was the greatest thing to happen to Canada, but I think this article downplays dramatically the significance of Canada's role in WWI. The Canadian Corps, by the end of the war, were the 'storm troopers' of the empire. That is a fact, there is no myth there. Go read about the last 100 days of the war, and see how the the Canadian Corps was moved secretly to spearhead the assault of the German lines.

    I'm just saying, Vimy Ridge is a little bit of a myth, but we should still be proud of it and the accomplishment as Canadians
  3. Tom Shaffer from Victoria, Canada writes: Vimy Ridge is indeed part of Canadian mythology, but what's wrong with that? Every nation, every people, every person needs his or her mythology to maintain any sort of sanity in this insane world. My own view of the battle of Vimy Ridge is flavoured largely by Pierre Burton's book, 'Vimy', which I enjoyed reading so much. So maybe an element of mytholgy has crept into the true history of Vimy. So what? Those who fought, suffered, died, or survived in the battle of Vimy Ridge are all heroes in the making of Canada, a great nation.

    Come on, Michael Valpy. Don't be so synical. Allow us some freedom of pride, even though we may not deserve 100% of it.
  4. James Clost from chaozhou, guangdong, China writes: a good article.

    nothing should overshadow the ceremonies on monday, lets just remember what happened at vimy ridge.
  5. Enzo Campini from Brampton, Canada writes: I don't understand what it is about Vimy that gets Canadians so hard. Back in WWI, Canada was a little semi-country lorded over by Great Britain. Canadians only fought and died in WWI because our big brother Great Britain forced us to.

    How proud are we supposed to be of that?
  6. mike wood from Dryden, Canada writes: While I have always appreciated good journalism, I find it troubling that the author goes to great lengths to dismiss the efforts of so many great Canadians that volunteered and gave their lives for the freedom we still enjoy to this day. While I am quite certain that Mr. Valpy has every right to pass judgements on the acts of bravery and sacrifice that allow him to quietly sip a morning coffee, I am also quite certain that the acts of all Canadian soldiers deserve a tad more respect than the tone of this article affords them. I am quite sure that Mr. Valpy remains smug in his assessment that Vimy wasn't entirely special or relevant in the scheme of the war. That he has the audacity to judge the efforts and sacrifices of those who gave of themselves is astonishing. Whether Vimy was or was not the 'birth of our nation' is irrelevant insomuch as Canada and Canadians have decided that it should be considered so. Vimy was, is and always will be viewed as a symbol of our nationhood. Perhaps the only thing I find more disturbing than than Mr. Valpy's disregard for these soldier's sacrifices is the disregard that our current Conservative government has shown in their treatment of Vimy Ridge in 2007. While Mr. Valpy seems to disregard and denograte these sacrifices as trivial and inconsequential, our Prime Minister has chosen to use the 2007 ceremonies at Vimy Ridge as a partisan demonstration of national pride. Despite repeated requests from Liberal MP's to travel to Vimy to honour the Canadians who gave of themselves in this battle and throughout WW1, Mr. Harper refused to allow ANY opposition MP's to travel to Vimy to mark this occasion even on their own dime, save and except one representative. That Mr. Valpy dismisses the efforts at Vimy is troubling, but Mr. Harper's pettiness is appalling. Is this the Canada we should be proud of? A Canada that denogrates our past, exploits the present and sells our future? I will not. Mike Wood Dryden ON
  7. Dave Parry from Calgary, writes: I haven't read the book but the article seems to suggest that taking Vimy wasn't a large enough tactical battle to be treated with such importance. But sometimes it's little things that make an event important, that make it a turning point. Little, or not so little, things such as the volume and quality of innovations that were applied in that battle. Okay Canada's part was just a diversion, a diversion that originally wasn't expected to actually take the objective. But a great deal happened in that diversion, in the way that it was carried out by the Canadian Corps and the units supporting it, setting a course for the future. May they rest in peace.
  8. Jim Terrets from Vancouver, writes: No offence, but its just plain stupid to glamourize, glorify and mythologize this battle and try to imbue it with some sort of symbolism as it pertains to the 'Canadian identity.' Seriously, what is wrong with us? Why is necessary to glorify war? Can't we find something else that defines Canada? There is nothing glorious or glamorous about some 18 year old kid lying on a muddy battlefield in a pile of his own feces with his entrails hanging out, crying for his mother. Because that's what war is, and there is nothing good about it. Surely there is some other event that categorizes Canada better than a martial exploit from a completely senseless and avoidable war such as WW1.

    Don't get me wrong, all the Canadian soldiers who fought in that war deserve to be honoured for their patriotism and their sacrifice, but let's honour their sacrifice in a better way, by looking for something peaceful and beneficial to mythologize so that we never have to sacrifice young men in that fashion ever again.
  9. James Clost from chaozhou, guangdong, China writes: ' mike wood from Dryden, Canada writes: While I have always appreciated good journalism, I find it troubling that the author goes to great lengths to dismiss the efforts of so many great Canadians that volunteered and gave their lives for the freedom we still enjoy to this day. While I am quite certain that Mr. Valpy has every right to pass judgements on the acts of bravery and sacrifice that allow him to quietly sip a morning coffee, I am also quite certain that the acts of all Canadian soldiers deserve a tad more respect than the tone of this article affords them.'

    agreed. i read it a second time and i think the author has really shortchanged us here.

    mike, how did PM harper prevent ANY opposition MPs from travelling to vimy for the ceremony, even at their own expense? i imagine anyone with a passport and enough money to get to vimy is welcome to the view the ceremony. how did PM harper manage all this and when and where did he state that only one opposition MP could travel (as part of the official delegation i suppose you're saying) with government officials? just curious as i am not aware of any of what you say here.

    ' Enzo Campini from Brampton, Canada writes: I don't understand what it is about Vimy that gets Canadians so hard. Back in WWI, Canada was a little semi-country lorded over by Great Britain. Canadians only fought and died in WWI because our big brother Great Britain forced us to.

    How proud are we supposed to be of that?'

    enzo, while most canadians can remember what happened at vimy with pride and sorrow, perhaps you can reflect on the 20th century military victories of your ancestral homeland.
  10. Vern McPherson from Toronto, Canada writes: I am offended by the unnecessary trivializing of the battle of Vimy Ridge. Who is Valpy pandering to ? Why would he write this story in the first place ? There are glaring gaps in the facts presented in support of what I consider an empty acedemic and pointless analysis. For example the innovations introduced by Arthur Currie, (a name conspiciously missing in the story), such as the the creeping barage and the idea of pinpoint (for that time) artilliary aimed by a host of spotters at the battle intended specifically to take out German guns while all the artilliary up to that time was simply a mass hit and miss proposition by the British and French shot in the general direction of oppositon trenches or into no man's land. While enormous barages preceeded every British/French infantry offensive up to the time Canadians attacked at Vimy, there were many and repeated reports after offences these hadn't even cut the barbed wire lines - the prime objective of artillary in the minds of British/French strategists. Not mentioned either was the conflict Currie had with British FM Haig the Chief of Staff and chief soldier on the western front British forces. Currie wrested control of the Canadian Corps from this mad pathetic man, united it into a full 4 division fighting force and proceeded to plan the offensive and take Vimy, a prime objective in the Arras battle since it provided a clear view and control of the area surrounding the Ridge and the Douay plain which stretched out behind the German lines. Canada did it mostly in one morning suffering 13 thousand casualties in total over 4 days while the previous multi attempts under Haig's old charge and charge again tacticts had cost the Allies 90,000 men. So what if there is a little myth involved,. The Charge of the Light Brigade was not a victory yet it was made into a myth. At least Canadians took their objective at Vimy and did not die needlessly that day as cannon fodder as the British calvalry had in the Crimea.
  11. Sheldon Maerz from fromadustyplace, Canada writes: As per normal, the usual losers come out of the woodwork- those bent on their social revisionist history so they can sell books, those who claim our soldiers died only to satisfy the needs of England, and those who claim by remembering our past we are glorifying war - all are equally dense and bring no credible voice to any discussion on Vimy, or Canada's contribution during the Great War. Although Vimy was not Canada's greatest victory of the First World War (now you will have to do some research, won't you), it was and remains incredibly important. Modern day know-it-alls can make all the claims they want - read the first hand accounts that still exist of those who where there - they tell you from the lowest Private to a BGen, what the victory meant to the men in the field, and more importantly to our Allies. For those who need American validation, like the losers you are, check the prominent American papers of the day - that will shut you up. You can think want you want today, but if you don't know your history, and don't know the context of the time, your are playing at folly. By the way, Vimy was a huge victory where other nations forces had failed - the only reason no breakout occurred was that the higher command, Gen Haig - Comd of the BEF prepared for none, as he did not think the Canadains could take the Ridge. Finally, the monument at Vimy is not about the Glory of War at all - if you had ever stood on the Hallowed Ground that is Vimy you would know it is about the sacrifice of a young nation and about loss of individual soldiers (hence their families).
  12. Enzo Campini from Brampton, Canada writes: James Clost from chaozhou, guangdong, China:

    First, my ancestral homeland is a combination of Italy (50%), Ireland (25%), and Scotland (25%). Don't take swipes at people because of their names. Besides, all Canadians, except Aboriginals, come from other places.

    Second, I think we should all remember Vimy with sorrow, but not with pride. Like I said, it was not a war in which Canada had any say or willing participation. Insofar as any Canadians fought willingly and with great pride, it was the Anglo-Saxon Protestant Canadians, who love 'Mother England', but who have never been a majority in this country to begin with.

    It was a war controlled by others. Canada was led into it on a leash. Many Canadians would agree with me on that count.
  13. mike wood from Dryden, Canada writes: James Clost from chaozhou, guangdong,

    Dear Mr. Clost,

    Prime Minister Harper and his government have disallowed all but one opposition MP to attend the Vimy Ridge ceremonies in an official capacity. While nothing prevents any individual from travelling to Vimy Ridge, participation in the official ceremonies has been limited to members of the conservative party 1 member of the official opposition.

    In my eyes, this decision is tantamount to excluding Canadians from attending Remeberance Day ceremonies soley on the basis of political affiliation.

    In a world where perception is reality, what reality would Mr. Harper have Canadian's believe and embrace? Are we to believe that one must be a member of the Conservative Party to show respect, empathy and appreciation?

    I for one hope that our national identity isn't shaped by the political skullduggery which seems to be perfected by other nations.

    Canada has a National identity of tolerance, compassion and inclusiveness. I'm loathe to see it being traded away for the sake of a photo op.

    What is the point of nation without identity?

    We have been there. Let's not go back.

    Mike
  14. Enzo Campini from Brampton, Canada writes: Also, I find it distinctly fascinating how most people who glorify Canada's participation in liberating the French during WWI and WWII tend to be conservative types who love to look down their noses at the French. I wonder why that is.

    Are we to be proud because we assisted the English to liberate their French allies? All the while, the Limeys and the Frenchies were colonizing other peoples in other parts of the world.

    As far as WWI is concerned, the laugh is on us, for having had 70,000 die in a war that had nothing to do with higher ideals, but only with the machinations of empires that had nothing to do with us.
  15. Vern McPherson from Toronto, Canada writes: Moreover, the memorial WAS erected at Vimy, not at Passchendale or Ypres. It could have been erected in Ottawa for that matter. But Vimy represented the greatest and victory and most rapidly executed success over the Germans up to that time and heralded new methods of co-ordinated attacks rather than over the top charge after charge that had failed and cost the British under Haig 60,000 men on the first day of the battle of the Somme for example - ad a total of 800.000 casualties in the entire battle over several months. Currie would not agree to wholesale slaughter on this level. At future offensives Currie rejected Haig's demand that the Canadians simply charge Passchendale and insisted on a co-ordinated attack in order to take that objective. In fact he predicted with astounding accuracy the number of casualties ( 16,000) the Canadian Corps would take - before the battle ! Haig had no choice but to follow his recomendations because he faced disgrace and being fired for lack of success and enormous losses in his recent offensives. So what if thre is a little myth attached to the Vimy story ? What is history without a little myth ? Cold hard facts and nothing else ? I suppose Valpy is entitled to make his own interpretation of it all but I just don't see the point. Are we to conclude the Victoria Crosses won by Canadians at Vimy were undeserved ? Or the sacrifices they made were myth ? Or the planning was entirely British when they had failed miserably up to then and cost the lives of hundreds of thousands of their soldiers needlessly in blind charges over the top ? Does anyone really think a few Spartans held off all those others on a bridge ? Or that America won both world wars all by their lonesome ?
  16. Sheldon Maerz from fromadustyplace, Canada writes: And beyond my previous comments, the reason why Vimy remains pivotal to the Canadian collective memory is the unquestionable fact that it was the anvil upon which the sword of the Canadian Corps was forged. The Corps had achieved a great succes, taking the most heavily defended part of the Western Front from the Germans where previous attacks had faultered and failed. After Vimy, the Canadian troops in the field regarded themselves as something special, and as any fool knows, once a body of soldier honestly believe they are the best, they usually become the best (hence the proliferation of all the Special Forces in almost all military forces world wide). As the Canadians were a National Corps, the believe that they were the best became rooted in their national identity. After Vimy, the Canadians succeed at Lens and Hill 70, at Passchendale, and during the 100 Days, and were truly the 'Spearhead to Victory'. Those Victories had their foundation in the success at Vimy. Wake up, and get to know your past - then maybe you will know who we are today.
  17. M McIsaac from London via Stoney Creek, United Kingdom writes: People, this article is not attacking the boys who sacrificed their lives at Vimy or anywhere else during that bloody conflict. Britain did not force Canadians to join arms in 1914. Boys did everything they could to get over there. That is why this battle is so important to Canadians. Towns and villages had lost a generation of young men, many returned shellshocked and injured. Vimy is a beautiful monument that doesn't conjor images of glory, it creates a very sombre and reflective environment. Anybody whoever has or wanted to study hisory needs to understand the importance and power of myths. I studied under Prof Hayes at Waterloo, I believe we looked at Mythology from the Spanish American War. But we also looked at War of 1812 Mythology, Paul Revere and even our beloved Laura Secord is shrouded in Myth. Do people who read History books really want facts left out? I want to know the spin on historical events and figures. It doesn't mean I don't want some romantacism in reading about the history of great nations. I just want the spot light shone in the corners. In England, most definitely East London, there is a real mythology about the blitz spirit of Londoners. Sure a lot of people carried on with life as normal and chipped in to do what they could, but many looted from their neighbours homes and shops, stirred up racial bigotry. This myth that Londoners all pitched to do their bit is rubbish, people would steal their neighbours ration booklet whenever a handbag was left unattended. But people glow when they talk about the Blitz. It helped them get over a traumatic experience. The article is saying that Vimy had a few details left out in order to help a grieving nation of mothers who would never see their little boys (some younger than 16) ever again. The mythology was useful but we are 90 years removed from that war. Mentioning that some British people had a hand in its success is not going to render the mood or importance of the event.
  18. Sheldon Maerz from fromadustyplace, Canada writes: Wow, you really try to get under the skin, don't you - 'old man', etc. Well Mr. Johnny come lately, Canada is much more than what you believe it to be, but then I am willing to bet you have never been East of Superior, have you, or how about evne out of Southern, On. The truth is most Canadian do give a damn, and it is mainly those here for economic gain that don't give to hoots - that is fine, but in time, as the generations pass, even their children will come to understand and to care. Go abroad, and some place other than Italy, and you will learn what the rest of the World thinks about Canadians - that perception is not due to your ramblings on us being a 'post-modern, post-industrial and multiculutural country. Instead it has everything to do with the fact that on two noted occassion in the last century and on many lesser ones, our sons have gone forward voluntarily (by the huge majority) to liberate other peoples. The world remembers that and I have experienced the gratitude first hand in Holland, France and Belgium. Perhaps when you wake up to a true Canadian indentity, you will appreciate this more and then realize the stupidity of your own drivel.
  19. Sheldon Maerz from Canada writes: Good night, Enzo - your drivel is not worth any more of my time. I will sleep well knowing you have been sorted.
  20. James Clost from chaozhou, guangdong, China writes: ' Enzo Campini from Brampton, Canada writes: Also, I find it distinctly fascinating how most people who glorify Canada's participation in liberating the French during WWI and WWII tend to be conservative types who love to look down their noses at the French. I wonder why that is.'

    enzo, how did you reach the conclusion that conservative types look down on the french?

    as for the rest, people arent 'glorifying' war, what i think most people want to ensure in remembering this event, is to make certain that we never forget what our ancestors achieved under the most difficult circumstances that humans can be put into - war. and what they achieved is something to be proud of. i suppose for some people who've never spent a day in the military and who have no idea how difficult a soldiers work can really be, it may be difficult to see. if you dont feel any pride in anything our military has achieved in the past, then thats up to you. i dont see that you'll have a lot of company though.

    and enzo, as for the 'swipe' i took at your ancestry, it was well deserved in my opinion. reread your comment that led to it.
  21. Enzo Campini from Brampton, Canada writes: ames Clost from chaozhou, guangdong, China: Indeed, you may be correct that my lack of pride in Canada's military history (or in Canada's current effete military) leaves me in scarce company. But that's okay. I don't run with the herd.
  22. Michael Sharp from Tuliporia, Canada writes:

    My grandfather fought the Second and Third Battles of Ypres, Paaschendale, and Vimy.

    What these men did and died for is something we should always be grateful for.

    We've lost 40 some-odd soldiers in Afghanistan (no disrespect) in three years and the current MSM-fed populace thinks we're part of a malevolent plot to take over the world?

    Perspective.

    It's a shame it had to occur in the bloodiest war of human history, but Canada did what no other nation could do before it.

    It's our heritage, it's who we are.
  23. diane marie from calgary, Canada writes: Enzo:-- Whenever anyone questions war or militarism, these 'gentlemen' go on the attack. They use the language of anger and hate to refer to one's ancestors, and to question one's knowledge, understanding, and patriotism. I know, because I've been the target on occasion by several of these posters. A person who is not one-dimensional in his or her thinking can honour and regret the war dead yet deplore war and its institutionalization.
  24. Barry Johnson from Victoria-Canada not the US, United States writes: Great Article, the Globe and Mail got a bit more credible for allowing this to be published.
  25. Action Jackson from Kitchener, Canada writes: Enzo: we're not 'postmodern' -- that's a nonsense word. The news that we're 'postindustrial' will come as a shock to Ontario's auto workers. And if we're 'multicultural', it's in the sense that we allow for the expression of other cultural identities in conjunction with a central and robust Canadian culture, and not in any sense that requires Canadian culture to be hollowed out 'til it becomes just a blank space in which other cultures can be expressed. You talk about culture as if it were some ahistorical artifice that could be scripted by a committee ('social and cultural engineering'). Culture is far more complicated and grows unforeseen and unplanned from the accidents of history. It includes Vimy and the latest pop music and everything in between. I don't care what the 'new generation' thinks. They're still ignorant -- that's why they're still in school. (No disrespect: I was ignorant, too, when I was young.) Besides, a lot of them don't know much about WWII. So what? WWI wasn't as obviously a just war -- the Kaiser wasn't as bad as the Nazis. Still, it was good for Canadians to fight against Germany in WWI, for even in view of the many flaws of France, the UK and the US, those liberal democracies were better than their rivals, and we reap the rewards of their victory to this day. I don't care if Vimy Ridge turns out not to have had an impact on the direction of the War. The guys who died there didn't have to do so. They had choices. They chose to put their lives on the line for ideals that have helped to define our nation then and now. If you told me that 99.9999% of the younger generation doesn't care, I would still wear a poppy in early November and feel proud about this part of our history.
  26. Jim **** from Canada writes: I think the article pointed to some confusion about why Canadian troops fought at Vimy and elsewhere. My two Canadian Expeditionary Force uncles, despite having migrated from England five years earlier, were already patriotic Canadians. But the Canada they were patriotic to was also thoroughly part of the British Empire. So they weren't patriotic to Canada the way we might think of it today.

    Nor can I discern that they were fighting for ideals that we put at the top of our list today. When I read their letters I don't read about their loyalty directly to democracy, or human rights, or the independent Canadian nation. Rather I sense a loyalty and sense of duty to the British Empire, which they might have viewed as a great civilising force in the world, regardless of its deficiencies.
  27. Jim **** from Canada writes: Having visited many of the Canadian cemeteries at Vimy and near Ypres, I'm concerned that many of the memorials and much of the interpretive material seemed to have come from a particular mindset, one that glorifies the military successes and positive aspects of the conflict. The stunning Vimy Memorial itself is an exception.

    When my generation dies, there will be no one left who remembers the people who fought in WWI, and it will be time to give those memorials and cemeteries back to the people of Belgium and France. In perpetuity.

    I'm glad Michael Valpy has challenged the conventional view. I'm glad I live in a country where we don't cling to our illusions.
  28. James Young from Brantford, Canada writes: The only real tragedy is that the Generals and Senior Officers were not court martialled and possibly shot for creating such slaughter of their own.

    Most of the operations of WW1 epitomize ignorance, stupidity and incompetence of the military leaders, and not much has changed since.

    Durgan.
  29. Mariposa Belle from Leacockland, Canada writes: From the Pictorial History of the Great War, published in 1919. From that hour to the end of the war Canada always had a place in the line. To her credit stands one brilliant victory after another and many a stout defense. Langemarck and St. Julien are names on the Canadian honor roll. It was there that the sons of the Maple Leaf saved the day when the enemy, in April 1915, broke thru the line of the French colonial troops by the use of gas. Canada closed the gap, and, at terrific price held the enemy at bay for over 72 hours until re-enforcements could arrive. In the battle of the Somme the names of Courcelette and the Regina redoubt are remembered among the names of places that are forever identified with Canadian courage. The taking of Vimy Ridge will be one of the great and often told stories in the history of the Dominion. It was the Canadians, who, after other troops had tried for weeks to capture Passchendaele, northeast of Ypres, did the job and came back from victory a mere tattered and wounded remnant. Canada, by voluntary enlistment and conscription, raised an army of about 500,000 men. Her population is barely more than 8,000,000. An army of like proportion in the United States would number over 10,000,000. Interesting to see that the British writer of this piece was aware of the iconic status that Vimy was starting to take on as early as 1919.
  30. Tom Langford from Montreal, Canada writes: Enzo Campini from Brampton, Canada writes:How proud are we supposed to be of that?

    We should be very very proud! Lets put it in modern day perspective and maybe you'll get it!

    If the majority of the able bodied Afghanisani men were as willing as our Canadian ww1 and ww2 vets to stand up and fight for their country just maybe THAT war would be over by now.

    Do I also have to mention the quality of life you now enjoy BECAUSE our vets were willing to fight for this country?

    God some of these posts make my Canadian blood boil!!!

    This article makes my Canadian blood boil. I wonder if MICHAEL VALPY would have the guts to go fight a war or would he think his part would be too trivial to make a difference!!!!

  31. Bob MacMillan from Hamilton, Canada writes: Vern McPherson, I thought your comments at 2:16 about the casualties were the most insightful ones posted last night. Both of my grandfathers were at the battle for Vimy. My mother's dad was a recent British immigrant who enlisted in Saskatchewan. My father's dad enlisted at Lindsay Ont. at the age of 15. He was 16 years old at Vimy. He grew up in a remote town in northern Ont. and was used to a rough outdoors lifestyle. His family had already been in Canada for about 5 generations. Both grandfathers survived the war. I never spoke with my maternal grandfather, but I had several conversations with the other. Two major themes came through. One was the appalling loss of life (and the indifference on the part of the British high command). The other theme was pride in Canada's role. The British were reluctant to give the 'Colonials' much independence. However, partially due to the Vimy success, Canadian farm boys built a reputation of being very capable and tough fighters. According to my grandfather, it got to the point where efforts were made to hide Canadian troops coming into the line. The Germans considered them as superior assault troops and an indicator that a 'Push' was coming in their area. Unfortunately, there were many questions I never got to ask my grandfather. I didn't get a proper understanding of what he went through until after he died. I was very grateful to Pierre Berton for his book on Vimy. He put in enough details that I could figure out where both grandfathers were on the day. War is a gruesome business and it's hard to the emotions right - Don't to be too proud or glorify it, and never forget the cost.
  32. D C from Canada writes: Nice piece of research from Messieur Valpy of course, and factually inarguable. Dry history often obscures deeper meanings, symbols which when taken at the flood in opportune times lead on to greater cohesion and purpose. This nation has faced the midnight hour on the doomsday clock several times, from within, with referenda being the instrument marking a division of myths. Today, given the Vimy moment in history we must understand that we have become essentially dysfunctional and we must understand Quebeckers no longer care about referenda, because like a women leaving the marriage bed, in their minds they are 'already gone'. It is an interesting analogy for me to compare the Quebecer with the feminine entity in society, as so much of the relationship can be so construed and defined. The male 'law-giver' in this rather Freudian scenario is the rest of Canada. Who really splits the marriage generally?
    More worrisome than anything else is a remarkable writing by David Warren in the Citizen today, 'We Are Men of Straw' because he touches upon the essential narcissism in our land... which when examined by even looking at all these writings above mine can be clearly seen, and it really is all about youse ! Warren says about the returned sailors --------- 'Worse, to my mind, was the cheerful reception they received on returning home, and the statements they gave to the media once they were in freedom. There was no condemnation of the Iranians for having held them illegally. Just expressions of happiness to be home, phrased in the contemporary way, so that every sentence can be parsed to reveal some underlying narcissism. It was as if the whole incident was 'all about them.'

    and that my friends is something you should fix on as to the ikon or date from which and when the end of our way of life can be mythically measured.

    but I grow weary and feel as if I cast pearls before......
  33. Lisa Jones of the Anglo-Celtic nation within a nation from !,, Canada writes: Furthermore, let's not forget that a huge number of the volunteers fighting in Canadian units were volunteers from the USA. I don't know why Canada's media constantly omits that important detail.
  34. billy bob from Timmins, Canada writes: Let's talk myths shall we how about the liberal myth or how about lie that Canada was a multicultural county when Trudeau came to power because it was'nt .A quick look at a high school yearbook from that time will quickly expose that lie. How about the lie that recent immigrants are contibuting to canada when it is estimated that 18 billion has been spent on them than they have contributed in taxes.How about the lie that Canada was always a peacekeeping country when Canadians have a long and distinguished history of fighting for freedom.Lots of myths/lies from the left but why aren't they questioned?The list of myths from the left is endless.
  35. Paul Jay from Canada writes: This Valpy article is another example of someone thinking about something, and we can't have that in today's day and age. If we applied the thought process to war issues, the west would never have invaded Iraq, and then where would we be? Good on you commentaters who don't like thinking about things.
  36. Jason Roy from Nova Scotia, Canada writes: Vern McPherson - very well researched!!
  37. William Hunt from St. John's, Canada writes: I find the whole notion that Canada became a nation at Vimy Ridge a bit simplistic. I don't for a minute question the incredible courage it took for those young men to climb out their trenches that morning. I do question the idea that it took that sacrifice to make Canada a nation. I think we'd now be much better off if the politicians of the day had managed to avoid a stupid war, and if those young men had lived, had careers and families, and made positive contributions to the growth of the nation.
  38. Jack MacLeod from Moncton NB, Canada writes: Reviewing a lot of Canadian Media reporting and comments on the Battle of Vimy Ridge I am astonished that the late Pierre Berton's masterpiece
    'Vimy' is never mentioned nor considered for what it really is, the best and most informative real reporting of the famous Battle. When I was a teenager in Halifax NS in the 1940's I remember that just up the street from us was a well known member of our Irish Roman Catholic Parish who fought on Vimy Ridge.
    I remember my father saying, (himself a Veteran of World War I) 'won
    a Medal next to 'the VC' -the Distinguised Conduct Medal (DCM) now gone like all the other famed Commonwealth Medals thanks to Pearson and his Defence Minister Helyer. There is nothing whatever 'mythical'
    about Vimy - it was a typical massed infantry battle in a war fought by the use of masses of troops most of whom were killed or wounded on
    both sides. The British and Canadian Armies succeeded at Vimy because of the steadfast quality of their troops, and the fact that the German and Austrian soldiers were decimated - God bless them all.
  39. L.B. Murray from Canada writes: LISA JONES and others of the same racist and hateful group, let me REMIND YOU that this weekend, I am thinking of my American grandfather who volunteered in 1914 to go fight in Europe with the Canadians, since US was not yet at war. I am thinking of my grand-father and my great-uncles on my mother's French-canadian side who fought at Vimy ... I am also thinking about all my family members on both sides of the border US-Canada border, some French-speaking, some English-speaking, who fought in wars from WW1, WW2, Korea, Vietnam, and the latest, a cousin in Gulf War 1 . LISA JONES and others of the same racist and hateful group, you do not deserve to live in peace-loving Canada. God help our BRAVE TROOPS in Afghanistan and bring them home safe and sound. Thank you.
  40. D B from Canada writes: Once again, Canadian accomplishment is minimized, in an attempt to erase all forms of national identity. Michael Valpy, your pencil-neck revisionist history makes me sick. How dare you question the significance of the sacrifice made by over 10,000 Canadians at Vimy, and before you thumb your nose at it, ask yourself this question: Could I have done what so many did, in such a selfless manner?

    Every time Canadians try to believe they've contributed something worthwhile to the history of the world, there is always some (Canadian) intellectual racing to find a way to discredit it.

    This Monday, I will take the time to remember what other Canadians have done so that I can live in one of the best countries in the world. Michael Valpy, on the other hand, will be working on his next article: 'Hey Kids, The Easter Bunny Isn't Real, You know?'
  41. L.B. Murray from Canada writes: Lisa Jones, following your comments yesterday, let me remind you that QUEBEC's French-speaking Royal 22e Regiment are going to Afghanistan during mid-Summer and since the Vimy memorial conversation closed just before I could answer attacks on the 22e and French-canadian troops in general, I hope the Globe and Mail will allow me to post this answer to the racist comments re troops from Quebec. LISA JONES, you do remember SAM HUGHES who refused to accept French-canadians in ''his'' military... Shame on you, LISA JONES, for posting such hateful garbage non-stop, especially about the Royal 22e Regiment. The 22e is sending at least 2000 troops to the worst part of Afghanistan around August 1st, when it is expected the Afghan war will take a turn for the worst with Taliban pouring in from the Pakistan border. May God protect our BRAVE TROOPS in Afghanistan and bring them home safe and sound. Thank you.
  42. Rob C from Toranna, Canada writes: Vern McPherson from Toronto ... Well stated!

    This article does this event a great disservice with it's one sided view.

    The revolution in strategies and military tactics that the commanding officers and men back then executed; are still to this day practiced in modern warfare. How come that wasn't even mentioned and given its proper share in the article?

    It was also one of the first times, documented proof, of how the truly 'Canadian' identity was born. Look at the graffiti in those tunnels and the patches that those men wore proudly- it had the Maple Leaf- The future symbol later to grace the modern Canadian flag.

    Yes- it may be 90 years later- but the forging of a nation, with one hell of a backbone and guts to match was shown back then.

    So when I see people belittling it and missing the entire historical context- it shows the ignorance and downright 'revisionist' stupidity that the author seems to revel in labeling others with- yet is guilty of himself and is shown throughout his entire article.

    Now isn't that bloody ironic?
  43. Dave T from midwest, Canada writes: Readers who are interested in the Great War from a literary point of view are reminded of Paul Fussell's classic work The Great War and Modern Memory. His discussion on how the concept of irony, for example, was imprinted on the modern pysche as a consequence of the war is cited even today. With respect to Valpy's discussion of mythology, it is likely that mythology has greater resonance than a mere chronicle of events, but mythology has also its own trappings not the least of which is that it contains elements that are fictionalized. I think the soldiers deserve to be honoured for their sacrifice on Monday, but I also think the WWI was among the most pointless wars ever fought.
  44. Lisa Jones of the Anglo-Celtic nation within a nation from !,, Canada writes: To: LB Murray: Is that your real name: MURRAY - Name Meaning & Origin Last Name Meaning & Related Resources for the Surname MURRAY Definition: 1- A name given to a man from the region in Scotland, called Moray, which means 'by the sea.' 2- Possibly a modern form of the ancient Irish name 'O'Muireadhaigh.' Surname Origin: English, Scottish, Irish Alternate Surname Spellings: MURREY Now, I too have relatives from Quebec who would swear on the bible that they are French, and the truth is, that there's barely an ounce of French blood in them. Sure, somewhere way back in history, one of the men married a woman who was of mixed French/Anglo-celtic ancestry, who then stomped up and down and swore the entire anglo-celtic line was purlaine French because SHE has some French blood. This happens all the time in Quebec, where there are truly not that many French people, especially purlaines. Your ancesters likely fought because of the lineage to the United Kingdom or Ireland....Now, are you going to force me to post here again yet another posting about how the French Canadians of Quebec refused to fight in WW1, or are you going to believe the quotes and statistics I posted yesterday? As I said before, as someone who has so many ancesters who fought in those wars, as far as I know, most French Canadians who fought in the war were very ashamed of the way Quebec behaved (that being French Quebec) and they had no issues with the fact that French was not on the Vimy memorial. It didn't really deserve to be there. Furthermore, the origins of the Vandoos of Quebec, being the RCR had a huge number of anglo-celtic soldiers in WW1, as well as those of mixed French/anglo-celtic ancestry. It is only now that it has become exclusively French. And I sure hope then end up doing more than guarding the airport in Afghanistan, as they are now doing. But if Dion of the Quebecois nation had his way, they would not fight.
  45. Jack MacLeod from Moncton NB, Canada writes: Just up the way from the Grave of Major Audie L Murphy Medal of Honor US Army World War II in the US Arlington National Cemetary Virginia
    stands the Canadian Sword of Sacrifice Memorial erected on the order
    of Prime Minister MacKenzie King, Canada, to honor the thousands of
    United States Citizens who volunteered to serve in the Canadian Military in World War I and II -many lost their lives serving with Canadians in the Wars. Journalist Stevie Cameron's late Father a famed RCAF Pilot in World War II, an American Citizen and Veteran of the Spanish Civil War is one of those brave men commemorated there. The author of the famous poem
    'High Flight' was an American serving in the RCAF in World War II where he lost his life. MacLeod
  46. Michael Shannon from Iraq writes: It's amazing how the Germans are never considered in discussing Vimy. The Germans, prior to Vimy, had decided that most troops (up to 90%) should be kept out of the front lines ( to avoid massive artilery barages) and hidden in deep bunkers to emerge and counter-attack from the flanks and rear. The German commander at Vimy failed to employ this new tactic and the Canadian Corps was able to succeed in an attack with limited objectives. Later in 1917 at Ypres the German commanders would follow their docrine of defence in depth and seriously bloody the BEF. It was only after the incorporation of tanks, ground attack aircraft and wireless communications in 1918 that the British could overcome defence in depth.
  47. Another Opinion from Toronto, Canada writes: The author seems to be going to a lot of trouble to paint this 'issue' as some sort of secret conspiracy. The Canadian 'myth' that Vimy was important either to us or anyone else can, in the author's opinion apparently, be refuted by the fact that the Canadians were commanded by gasp* British troops and supported by *SHOCKING! British artillery.

    In the end, Vimy means something to Canadians because we chose to make it mean something to us. Every nation has, somewhere in their history, made heroes and martyrs out of people who may not have deserved it. Ultimately, there are very few heroic tales that can stand up under the cold light of hindsight.

    All that really remains is to pause briefly to wonder why, when so many Canadians have chosen to stop and honour these men, the author would choose to spend so much zeal pointing out one or two minor historical inconsistencies.

    I, for one, like having heroes.
  48. David Bareich from Windsor, Canada writes: While an interesting article and educational, I am saddened that the author has shown himself to be a true Canadian. Why is it that we can't praise ourselves in a modest way, allow ourselves the pride to create heros or create as the author suggests - myths based on reality. It's OK for other countries, but somehow Canadians just can't allow themselves to do it. Why should we feel less impressed or proud of the sacrifices made a Vimy by Canadians who where assisted and even commanded by others? Do not forget that WWI was not won by a single country, but rather by many working together. It is not insignificant that Canadian men, perhaps born in England, lost their lives while thinking of Canada - documentaries show that they carved their names, home towns, and a Canadian maple leaf - the same leaf as was on their insignia (because Canada lacked a flag at the time) into the cave walls below Vimy. They were Canadian at heart. Thank you for pointing out that even Vimy was a colaborative effort, but Canadians took the hill where others had not. Give them their due and let us live on with the myth that what we did there was great. I will teach my two children, and will likely take them to Vimy when they are old enough to understand, that Canadians fought for their freedom, that the efforts and sacrifices of those Canadians continue to be held in the hearts by Europeans and that respect is still shown at sites like Vimy. Even if it wasn't our biggest victory, it was significant at the time. Allow us to be proud of our heritage in a manner that every other country does. Come on Canada, it OK to pat yourselves on the back once in a while. Be proud, have heros, I don't consider it a myth, I respect what we lost on the ridge.
  49. Brad Buss from Toronto, Canada writes: Nice try Mr Valpy. Vimy is a poignant moment in Canadian history. Countries are born of fire and steel. Those who live in flower land and wish the world was driven through bee pollen and dancing nymphs are always disappointed. History is a collection of opinions and people's recollections of events. The combination of all these opinions become the history of the time. This is yet another opinion on an event that has been cemented into the Canadian psyche as a positive and dramatic event in out Country's history. Be proud of those men at Vimy that went over the trench line for freedom - lest we forget.
  50. Lisa Jones of the Anglo-Celtic nation within a nation from !,, Canada writes: Murray, how dare you come on here with your totally revisionist take on WW1. At NO TIME WERE FRENCH CANADIANS REFUSED PARTICIPATION IN WW1, BE THEY FROM QUEBEC OR OTHERWISE. Now, you have forced me to put this quote on this blog, something I did not want to do: Here is a direct quote from the times:'...........:..........By 1917 - after almost three years of fighting - the numbers of dead and wounded mounted overseas. In addition, voluntary enlistment by Canadians dropped drastically as jobs became plentiful at home. On May 18, 1917, Prime Minister Borden retreated from his earlier promise and introduced a conscription bill, the Military Services Act. While some English Canadians opposed conscription, nowhere was the outcry greater than in French Canada. The archbishop of Montreal, Monseigneur Bruchési sent a warning to Prime Minister Borden. 'Dear Sir Robert, Do you not think, in light of our population, that we have largely done our share? The people are agitated. ... In the province of Quebec; we can expect deplorable revolts. Will this not end in bloodshed?' Wilfrid Laurier, now Leader of the Opposition, was also convinced that conscription would tear the country apart. 'Is it not true that the main reason advocated for conscription - not so much publicly as privately, not shouted but whispered - is that Quebec must be made to do her part, and French-Canadians forced to enlist compulsorily since they did not enlist voluntarily?' .....Less than 5 percent of Quebec's males of military age were enrolled in infantry battalions, compared to 14-15 percent in Western Canada and Ontario. Moreover, half of Quebec's recruits were English Canadian and nearly half of French-Canadian volunteers came from provinces other than QuĂ©bec. The result was an angry national debate concerning French Canada's, and especially QuĂ©bec's, manpower contribution.
  51. Vern McPherson from Toronto, Canada writes: ' Lisa Jones of the Anglo-Celtic nation within a nation from Canada writes: Enzo, like it or not, Canada is a commonwealth country which recognizes the Queen as head of state. If you can't stomach that, then you SHOULD return to your ancestral homeland. England was not a foreign power at the time of WW1, .................... ' ------------------------------------------------- Where did you get this information ? 'England was not a foreign power at the time of WW1' ? Nothing could be further from the truth. Britain was near the height of it's colonial power with control over India, African colonies, colonies around the world and was THE sea power on the planet above all else. The truth is their massive Navy was the tool they used to keep world order and to maintain their colonies in subjugation by protecting the trade ships who robbed resources and built fabulous fortunes for British upper classes. Read up on the Battle of Jutland for a little background on the British Navy at that time. It could be argued in hindsite Britain's world influence was on the wane at that time and the forest was quite clear despite the trees on that subject but it wasn't until post WW2 that Britain's colonial reach had seriously declined and the world colonial power they had been for centuries previously was finished. Lisa if you insist on making up stuff, misinterpreting facts ( that's my gentle euphemism for lying), and creating history where it doesn't exist to fit your view of things I can only conclude you have some type of inferiority complex or perhaps a persecution complex relative to your pronouncements on 'anglo-celts'. The poor ignorami among us here (I include all the new uneducated little COns, poorly educated little COns for a little knowledge is dangerous and some older more sneaky ones), run a serious risk of believing the nearest big lie already if it is told often enough. So be careful with your bullsh.. out there eh.
  52. Dik Coates from Canada writes: 3500 deaths... for what? brought up now for the Afghanistan adventure... just government smoke and mirrors...
  53. Cup of Tea from National, Canada writes:
    Finally, an article that tells it like it is.

    If we were to listen to the politicians and their spin doctors we would continue to believe this was a war about freedom.

    Nothing could be further from the truth.

    It was a battle of petty political politics between elites and royals that manifested itself in the horrors of trench warfare. It was a disgrace and was known as the War to End all Wars.

    Get ready to hear Harper and his entourage try and tell you it was about freedom this coming Monday. And he will try and link Vimy to Afghanistan and the War on Terror.

    This alone is enough to have the man removed as a national disgrace.

    Thank you G&M for cutting through the hubris put out there by Harper and departmental spinners.
  54. Cup of Tea from National, Canada writes:
    Brad Buss from Toronto, Canada writes: ... went over the trench line for freedom - lest we forget.

    Keep smoking that stuff Brad, WWI had nothing to do with freedom.

    May they rest in peace.
  55. Michel Préfontaine from montreal, Canada writes: Thank you Micheal Valpy.
    My granduncle died at Arras, his brothers (my grand father included) voluteered and did their duty as did my father and his brothers in WW2. Third page recognition in Amercan and British newspaper never impressed my family very much however, and this sacrifice never made much sense from a 'nation building' perspective either. These lives, energy and resources would have been better spent elsewhere. Omar Bradley said that a soldier's job is to make war when politicians fail to make peace. When I see a war monument, I mostly see it as a monument to poltical failures.
  56. Matt Cross from Niagara, Canada writes: Can we take up a collection and send Enzo Campini to Vimy?

    Maybe then he'll understand the sacrifices made by those he denigrates, the same ones that have allowed him the freedom to express his ignorance of history for all to pity.
  57. L.B. Murray from Canada writes: Lisa Jones, Yes, L B Murray is my name, same name on my Canadian passport and same name on my social insurance card.

    Lisa, is that your real name? You sound very much like a very disturbed and hateful MAN. Shame on you for posting such hateful messages especially on this weekend when we should be thanking God for living in a peaceful country, Canada.

    Time for the once respectable Globe and Mail to return to fully moderated conversations. Thank you.
  58. Brad Buss from Toronto, Canada writes: ok Cup of Tea....living as a German wouldnt give me a lot of freedom. They fought for our freedom and our way of life. That's the way it is.

    Michel, war is the way humans resolve their differences. One group always want to push it too far (usually the bad guys).

    But I guess these posts are anonymous places to fight against the reality of the world. Show me how it's different.
  59. Bob Beal from Edmonton, Canada writes: Lisa Jones: The conscription debate is over and done with. And, Canadian Minister of Militia, the at-least-slightly-unhinged Sam Hughes, was very much anti-French. When Hughes was finally forced to resign in November, 1916, a Montreal newspaper commented: 'Hughes has managed to antagonize everyone in Quebec. Those French Canadians who have volunteered for the English war have been insulted. The recruitment posters, training and instruction manuals are in English only. More importantly, promotions have only been given to the English-speaking officers. How can Hughes and other Canadians expect French Canadians to join in the war effort when they are treated so poorly?'
  60. James Young from Brantford, Canada writes: Lisa Jones of the Anglo-Celtic nation within a nation from !,, Canada writes: James Young, read my submission to Enzo. Are you too descended from cowards?

    Lisa I did my time in the line. But I suspect I have descended form people who can think and reason, and can recognize BS when it appears. Jingoism has been the cause of a lot of unnecessary deaths in the past and also the present.

    WWI was a totally unnecessary war and the civilized world's growth was inhibited considerably by the deaths of a whole generation. Most of the poor dumb dead had no idea why they were fighting except their masters ordered such. Most were like lambs taken to the slaughter. Maybe someday we as people will rise above the stupidity of killing our own for obscure reasons.

    Durgan.
  61. D C from Canada writes: jingoism is never healthy. Forged in battle Canada stood strong, on the myth or the reality, no matter. We belonged .... to a nation that had a leader who opined ....'if it last for a thousand years, men will say this was their finest hour...' Their finest hour.... was Vimy our finest hour? Passendale perhaps where my Grandfather took some shrapnel, on top of the gassing he'd already suffered and living for 86 years never lived truly normal with the breathing and all?
    But jingoism has a flip side - embarassed tolerance, and moral relativitism...wherein we placidly go about unmindful of the forces yet arrayed against our way of life, our sisters and brothers and our churches and indeed our Parliamentary Democracy, and we blindly allow it into the land, spreading , seeping like a plague under the doors of our land , appeasement.
    Are we yet worthy of the sacrifices of Vimy ? or indeed the Scheldt Estuary which my regiment cleared and upon whose colors the battle is listed... the RHC 'Blackwatch' ! nemo me impune lacessit
    have our purile policies and politicians put 'paid' to the myth finally and at last? Has our spine been dissolved in the stew of benign neglect ? Yes. Our current government is our last best hope.
    Pray for us.
  62. Bob Beal from Edmonton, Canada writes: Unlike other posters, I do not see that this article denigrates the efforts and sacrifices of the Canadians at Vimy. It puts the battle in the larger context of the war and in the context of the 'Vimy myth' that developed after the war. It is not revisionist, and says nothing that historians have not been saying for a long time. Vimy was just one of a number of WWI battles in which Canadians distinguished themselves. But that particular battle was emphasized and mythologized in a way that contributed significantly to a developing Canadian identity. The war-to-end-all-wars itself was mythologized in various ways. One of my great-uncles, who was badly wounded near Vimy in 1918, wrote a book about the home front during WWI. He concluded: 'The issues of 1914-18 are the paramount issues of today and will be the paramount issues of the future as long as hate, greed, discrimination, inequality, frightfulness and injustice exist.' I don't agree that WWI was fought distinctly for those reasons, but I rather like the sentiment.
  63. Marc Lucas from Ottawa, Canada writes: Here is proof that the Globe and Mail still doesn’t mind publishing pointless, self-deprecating stories about our country. Michel Valpy did his best to belittle the Canadian victory at Vimy - even pointing out that some of the soldiers were only recent immigrants! How petty is that? I was expecting him to mention that the rifles the Canadian soldiers used were not even made in Canada.
    He neglected to point out numerous facts about the battle that should still make Canadians proud &8211; including Canadian-developed strategies that were rejected by the French and British before this battle. Before the Canadians took Vimy Ridge the British and French suffered hundreds of thousands of casualties trying to do what the Canadians did in 4 days.
    Is there nothing that Canadians can be proud of without being subjected to miserable self-deprecating journalism?
    War is horrible, but I don&8217;t think Canadians were hoodwinked into feeling national pride about the victory at Vimy.
  64. Don MacNeil from Barrie, Canada writes: I found the article completely insulting. While Mr. Valpy is thumbing his noses at Canada he might want to take some time to do consider the facts. Canadian commanders and officers came up with many innovative and successful strategies implemented at Vimy. From simple things like giving the men maps of the ground they had to cover to using machine guns in the same way as artillery are Canadian inventions. And as for the matter of the battle having no significance Hindenburg himself wrote in is diary after the battle that the war was lost.
    Mr. Valpy, you should be ashamed of yourself and the Globe should be ashamed of employing a 'history vandal' who would rather tear down the accomplishments of the brave men that fought and died at Vimy than acknowledge their contributions. You owe Canada an apology
  65. Brad Buss from Toronto, Canada writes: Well said Marc Lucas

    Don MacNeil...agree with the sentiment. These types of 'articles' are ironic in their intent because they enhance Canada's nationalism and passion for all things Canadian. Maybe Valpy is trying to employ reverse psychology!? Most likely he ran out of things to write so googled a contrarian view.
  66. Rob Doupe from Canada writes: Odd that many here accuse Valpy of denigrating the sacrifices of Canadians soldiers at Vimy. He does no such thing. All he's doing is putting the battle into historical perspective, and explaining how we built the mythology around it. I honestly don't see what folks here are getting upset about.

    I mean, Arthur Currie himself didn't want the memorial to be built at Vimy. He didn't think it was the most important battle fought by the Canadian Corp. I suppose Arthur Currie was a pencil-necked revisionist, and no patriot.
  67. Bob MacMillan from Hamilton, Canada writes: Oh well, wouldn't be a proper board without a bit of cat fighting... Conscription came up and I'd like to pass on my favourite story from my grandfather which ties in. (Applogies to anyone bored by this). By 1918 my grandfather had been found out and sent home as under-age. He returned to northern Ontario where the major mode of transportation between towns was the railroads. By that time some young men from Canada and the USA were trying to avoid conscription/draft by hiding out in remote northern towns. However it was easy for police to get on a train and search it from one end to the other looking for men trying to avoid service. My grandfather fit the profile and was regularly stopped to present his identification papers. He didn't like this process very much but it gave him great pleasure to point out a couple of things. One was that he was still underage at 17, so out of their control (he turned 18 two days before the war ended). The second was that he had discharge papers to show that he was already a veteran, and had been over there getting shot at while they had been fooling around riding trains... Sorry if that was a bit off topic, but I thought it shed a bit of light on Canadian conscription. It was also his favourite story about the war. He chose that one for me when I was young instead of more graphic details of what he had seen.