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'Proud, independent and free'

NEBI QENA AND WILLIAM J. KOLE

Associated Press

Latest comment posted at 10:51 PM EDT 16/02/08

Kosovo claims formal independence from Serbia in historic declaration ...Read the full article

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  1. Geoff Haskell from Canada writes: A historic precedent for state sovereignty. Will the UN and be backing Palestinian state any time soon I wonder?
  2. Al B from Toronto, Canada writes: Haskell, prove that Poland, pre-partitions, was a vassal of Russia.
  3. The NeoCynic from Cayman Islands writes: If anyone is surreptitiously celebrating, it is the Russians, for if the EU lets Kosovo separate unilaterally, then as a matter of consistency, and upon the exact same grounds, Putin will welcome the accession of the Georgian breakaway provinces of Abkhazia and South Ossetia.

    If war breaks out anew in Kosovo, for NATO, ISAF will be history in Afwhatistan.

    Vivre Le Quebec Libre!!!!
  4. Winter Wonderland from North of 40, Canada writes:

    Was NATO wrong to use force in order to stop ethnic cleansing?
  5. John Smith from Toronto, Canada writes: Shame, shame on EU and US! I will just quote Putin: independent Kosovo is illegal and immoral.
  6. Joseph T from Victoria, Canada writes: What a nutcase of a situation. The world needs another 'independent' state like you and I need a bullet in the head. This fragmentation of different nationalities on ethnic lines is counter productive to moving towards a formalised global government system. What kind of tax base will this new state have? Are other citizens from other nations going to be footing the bill for the expenses of this new nation? We are humans. All of us. We are not Martians....unless you are a Harper groupie.
  7. Geoff Haskell from Canada writes: Al B, Something about king making if I recall. Either way - the partitions were also followed by war and the collapse of Poland as a political entity, which at the time was weak. Not easily comparable to what happened in Serbia.
  8. tito broz from Kenya writes: welcome to independence ?! now 49 % of quebecers have right to take half of Quebec and declare it sovereign.... it's only fare.....
    and of course question is will canada can keep their ww2 war criminals in canada or should they share them proportionatelly with new quebec substate
  9. Ricky for a Centrist Canada from Canada writes:
    If only Milosevich were alive to see this.

    LOL.
  10. Andrew WWW from Whitby, Canada writes: The huge question is WHY? Why are our leaders against all the odds so readily support this independence?
  11. Jean Malice from Calgary, Canada writes: The globe and Mail keeps changing the story and the comment section that goes with it. Kosovo independence? And so what? what economy those albanians will develop? UN security council will not recognize it. What's next Quebec?
  12. Jack Robertson from Toronto, Canada writes: With the forced disintegration of Serbia, NATO/EU is helping to promote the growth of Islam in Europe and is sacrificing European culture, values and institutions in the process. It seems that none of the NATO or EU leaders remembers the name Neville Chamberlain.
  13. Al B from Toronto, Canada writes: That was weak, Haskell. There is no proviso to the effect that a weakened state forfeits its sovereignty. Besides Poland is not the only example. One has only to look at the European lands of the Ottoman Empire and the extensive redrawing of the maps at the Congress of Vienna. Moreover the concept of state sovereignty was superseded by the right of self-determination at Versailles.
  14. Al B from Toronto, Canada writes: Kosovo independence has no bearing on the situation in the Basque country and Quebec or what not, unless those regions are subjected to the same level of military repression by Spain and Canada.

    Robertson, I'm sure you were fearmongering with the same zeal when Bosnia became independent. The sky didn't quite fall out.
  15. Geoff Haskell from Canada writes: Al B, your examples involve countries whose borders were constantly shifting from war and alliance and again are poor comparisons. And what is 'self-determination' if not a convenient way of justifying interference into inconvenient problems like Kosovo. Shall me and my friends go up to the cottage and declare independence because we feel oppressed by taxes and unjust laws? Where do we draw the line?
  16. Al B from Toronto, Canada writes: You and your friends can declare independence whenever you feel like it. Can you get recognition? That's the key. Kosovo does. Real Politik.
  17. Roop Misir from Toronto, Canada writes: Does 'bracing for statehood' imply additional 'fireworks' in its aftermath?
  18. Average Dummy from Vancouver, Canada writes: I can only see one reason for the USA to go to bed with the Kosovo (Albania) Muslims.....Soon there will be a US army BASE, radar station and ballistic missile base in BALKANS.

    USA (and Izrael) with the help of NATO massacre the Muslims in IRAQ and Afghanistan, but the same radical beliefes of Al Queda and Taliban are being tolerated in Kosovo (Albania).

    All this is extremely dangerous to the European countries, as the export of drugs and potential terrorist attacks of the radical extremist will only increase with the help of the KOSOVO min-istate.

    Indeed the greater ALBANIA state will follow, but USA will have a military foothold in the Balkans.
  19. Antoine Pierpont from Canada writes: Very interesting. Serbia claims that Kosovo is part of a united country.

    The international scene disagrees on this matter.

    UNO is supporting the independance of Kosovo.

    On what side will be Harper? will he support Putin, the Russian great democrat, and against the UNO ?

    very interesting indeed.
  20. Ludo Geusens from Antwerp, Belgium writes: I fully agree with Average Dummy from Vancouver. Living in a European country, I feel daily the pressure from the US to destabilise the EU. Very soon we will see again a burning Balkan, while in several European countries a growing aversion exist against the growing pressure of radical Muslims to influence there existing laws and society.
  21. Stude Ham from Outremont, Canada writes: just what the world needed... another tiny little state of a few people unable to get along with their neighbours.

    europe at its worst.
  22. J Kooman from Canada writes: The only chance of a smooth transition lies in ample protection to the minority Serbians living in the area.

    At the end, the independence will not mean much. In the forseeable future of 10 to 20 years, both Serbia and Kosovo will be part of EU.
  23. J Kooman from Canada writes: There are obviously two sides to this story and the situation is gathering support from posters who are either pro-independence or on the other side favouring resolution with the neighour.

    The key lies in the scale. How small can you break a region down to form as many countries as its residents desire?

    Looking back to Canada. Should the scale be set at the size of a province (like Quebec), a municipal (like Montreal), or the size of Little Italy?

    Or it should be considered according to head count? composition of the residents? ...
  24. Clive Gingell from Canada writes: One thing's for certain, whatever Harper says about this, Dion will say the opposite.

    Dion probably has a half dozen pre-prepared speeches to cover any eventuality, (not that we'd be able to understand any of them).
  25. Dave Cawley from Edmonton, Canada writes: Ref to :Al B from Toronto-Kosovo independence has no bearing on the situation in the Basque country and Quebec or what not, unless those regions are subjected to the same level of military repression by Spain and Canada

    I do agree with most of the comments but would like to disagree with you on military repression portion; There are many nations those are subjected to even worse oppression than Kosovo. You can see this in Palestinian territories in Middle East & Tamileelam in Sri Lanka. Millions of palestinian people are still in refugee camps. Ref to Tamileelam,more 100,000 Tamils were killed by the Sri Lankan government & more than 1 million Tamils were driven out of Tamileelam by the Sri Lankan Sinhalese government, Tamil lands were colonized with Sinhalese to change the demography of Tamileelam. This has been happening over the past 60 years.

    So my point is, military oppression is not the prerequisite for recognizing independence of a nation, rather gobal politics & the vested interest of the countries recognizing the independence.
  26. Luke R from Toronto, Canada writes: This is the EU, NATO, the US, etc. at their worst. The Bosnian Serbs were not allowed to take their land and leave Bosnia to join up with Serbia. The Bosnian Croats were not allowed to take their land and join up with Croatia. They all had to remain within this half-baked unreal multi-ethnic state called Bosnia-Herzcegovina. But the ethnic Albanians are allowed to take a part of Serbia to form their own ethnic state?
  27. Robert Boyd from Windsor, Canada writes: har-har.What a Pollyanna.
    Czech and Slovak came apart without 'military repression'.
    Lead on Quebec.

    'Al B from Toronto-Kosovo independence has no bearing on the situation in the Basque country and Quebec or what not, unless those regions are subjected to the same level of military repression by Spain and Canada'
  28. Ron O'Brien from Canada writes: This is Serbian territory and should not be allowed !!
  29. Geoff Haskell from Canada writes: Well Al B, apparently all I need to be recognized by the UN is to start a civil war and make sure I come off looking like the poor little guy getting bullied for no reason - real politik!?!
  30. Benoit Evans from Quebec, Canada writes: Considering the treatment of Kosavars by the Serbs for many generations, no other solution was possible.

    The father of U.S. independence said it best in 1776:

    We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

    That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.

    I pray for the success of the Kosovars, in sha' Allah.

    Vive le Kosovo; vive le Kosovo libre!
  31. Andrew Major from Canada writes: The independence solves nothing, but we have increased chances of something horrible happening. The objective of solving the status question was

    1) thawing of the 'frozen conflict.'
    2) preventing of the partition of Kosovo.
    3) getting everyone in EU faster.

    And, let see what we have:

    1) the 'frozen conflict' (between North and South Kosovo, between Serbia and Kosovo) is still there, but there is greater risk of open 'hot' conflict.
    2) today, we are seeing not only a birth of new country, but its partition at birth. The serbs in north will set up parralell institutions that will look to Belgrade for guidance.
    3) Nobody is getting to EU faster. In Kosovo, we have a failed state with massive crime, unemployment and corruption. If anyone thinks the EU bureaucrats are more capable of solving this mess that UN bureaucrats, they are kidding themselves. The independence entrenches the rotten political and social structures that are the roots of the problem. People of kosovo need jobs, not more flags. On the other hand in Serbia, doing well since overthrowing Milosevic, the pro European forces have reached their peak with election of pro - European president two weeks ago. Now, the popularity of pro Moscow, ultra nationalists will only grow. These are people are interested in pipelines from Moscow, not laws from Brussels.

    So, that's three strikes.

    The only difference between now and early 199os in balkans is that today we, the west, are batting.
  32. Ted Andrews from Canada writes:
    VIVE LE QUEBEC LIBRE!
  33. Al B from Toronto, Canada writes: Dave Cawley. I agree. I did not stray into the Palestinians and Tamils situation for that reason.

    Geoff Haskell, the breakup of Yugoslavia along ethnic lines made it a foregone conclusion that Kosovo's independance was a matter of time. Kosovo didn't start the process, it is the end of the process. The Serbs by their repression made it impossible for reconciliaton. Even the Montenegrans who were closest to Serbia could not stand living in the same country with them. And yes start a civil war with your friends and get recognized by the UN. But you don't need to, We'll grant your independence. We'll just set up a customs post at the end your driveway and tax your import of groceries. And we'll require you to obtain a work permit to go into Canada. The way immigration is working, you may be out of the job for a while.
  34. C. O. from Toronto, Canada writes: I think Europe will come to regreat letting the Albanians steal Kosovo from Serbia.
    I've read that the Albanians pretty much opened the boarder after Nato took over and the statelet flooded with migrants.
    Serbia is being screwed big time by Europe for having a national interest and a sense of history.
    Shame on Europe and Nato
  35. Jacob Kasperowicz from Kirkland, Canada writes: RE: Jean Malice from Calgary, Canada writes: The globe and Mail keeps changing the story and the comment section that goes with it. Kosovo independence? And so what? what economy those albanians will develop? UN security council will not recognize it. What's next Quebec?

    As referendum fever pitched in 1995, Jacques Parizeau was pushing for a unilateral declaration of independence if the OUI side lost; Lucien Bouchard tugged the leash. That idea is, still,palatable to the hardcore separatists and has had a resurgence on French language talk radio & TV in the past 24hs. The cancerous plight by Quebec's separatist will be fueled by this event and Canada is in for a rough ride.
  36. Kurtis Smith from Canada writes: LOL Benoit you just quoted the declaration of independence. You really think that is relevant? Is Kosovo stepping out to fight alone against a vastly more powerful enemy? No, they are being carried out by the most powerful military in the world.
    I am sure that you know: Law in the United States makes it very clear that no state may leave the union. To attempt to do so is an act of war. People can leave but the land stays.

    If you wish to compare Kosovo to America then it follows that Serbia would have no choice but to hold its union together and fight.

    So Benoit maybe don't make such comparisons.
  37. john chuckman from Canada writes: Another useless, uneconomic, small state.

    It would make a little sense if they joined Albania, but this makes little sense.
  38. X. T. from Canada writes: john chuckman from Canada writes: Another useless, uneconomic, small state.

    It would make a little sense if they joined Albania, but this makes little sense.
    ----------------------------------
    The problem with Serbia, is that they did not make Albanian Kosovars feeling like home.

    What should have been done, is decorating the land of Kosovo with 50,000 Hohxa-style anti-insurgent pillboxes. Albanians simply can't feel like home without those wonderful beacons of freedom they once had in their homeland.
  39. X. T. from Canada writes: Viva Enver Hoxha!
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6nWNN48Rn0
  40. Yvonne Wackernagel from Woodville, Canada writes: 'Our hopes have never been higher,' he told the assembly. 'Dreams are infinite, our challenges loom large, but nothing can deter us from moving forward to the greatness that history has reserved for us.'

    WHAT Greatness? Their economy will be flat without the Serbs.
    See the Flag 'God Bless America'. The U.S. is constantly interfering in other countries' political systems and they wonder why they had 9/11, with lots more to come.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Reacting to the declaration, Serbian President Tadic urged international organizations 'to immediately annul this act, which violates the basic principles of international law.'

    International Law; The U.S. does not know what that means or they would have found the only solution in the Israel/Palestine conflict over 40 years ago with the U.N. resolutions - several of them.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    This would set a serious precedent for a lot more conflict in that part of the world and I, personally, will have no sympathy for the Albanians who allowed their stupid politicians to lead them by their dirty noses.
  41. vlad stanisic from Canada writes: Just a little detail for everyone to ponder. Not going too far back in history, KIM had probably a greatest level of autonomy any minority could hope for in the modern world. That included everything, from language, culture, schooling (up to university level), etc. Albanians had representation in the highest levels of government. KIM was getting subsidies from the rest of Yugoslavia as well as other underdeveloped regions. Large portions of population managed not to pay taxes or even basics such as utility costs. Illegal immigration from Albania was fairly common. The only thing that was not acceptable was separatism, especially violent. Even in that respect communist governments of the time were fairly indecisive, allowing constant exodus of non-Albanian population, forced out by perpetual, rarely sanctioned, intimidation, threats or open violence. This situation, combined with emergence of separatism in other Yugoslav republics brought Slobodan Milosevic to power. The rest is beyond the scope of this brief write-up. Speaking of KIM under KFOR rule: lets make it plain simple. With few exceptions it has been a living hell, concentration camp for non-Albanian population. Daily fear for a basic physical security, being confined to few safe areas under protection of KFOR. No jobs, no movement, just day to day existence with only hope left. How so, you may ask. Well few examples….A bus (with people, although Serbs, on their way to pay visit to graveyards beyond the boundaries of their ghettos) bombed despite being escorted by KFOR armoured vehicles, farmers shot while working in the field, children shot while enjoying hot summer day swimming in Bistrica river. And the list goes on….. Welcome to the new member state of the New World Order…
  42. Leo Geiger from Halifax, Canada writes: Independence movements don't have to make practical sense. Quebec is a perfect example. People in the rest of the world would look at the perceived wrongs that the separatists bring up to justify breaking out of Canada and scratch their heads in puzzlement.

    We shouldn't be afraid of the BQ and PQ making inappropriate and misleading comparisons using Kosovo. They've been making inappropriate and misleading comparisons for years.
  43. Mr. Justice from Canada writes: For each ethnic-religious-nationalist group to have a policy of mutual respect re the others would be to abandon their respective histories; this would be a VERY good idea.

    Slaughter, rape and destruction of property are the products of ethnic, religious, and nationalist 'pride' (=crap).

    ALSO: Kosovar Albanians differentiate themselves from the Albanians in Albania. Anybody know why?
  44. M Warren from Ottawa, Canada writes: An Independent Kosovo justifies an Independent Quebec or Alberta in the realm of International law, and I cannot support either. Russia and Serbia are right on this one.
  45. David Simon from Canada writes: Where are the Kosovo Serbs going to go? Will Serbia be able to take them in?
  46. Frank Enstein from Canada writes: With their atrocious behavior and violent actions in the past against the Kosovars , Serbia has lost any and all rights to continue to rule Kososvo. Kosovo must go on it's own for the same reasons that Croatia, Bosnia and the other former Yugoslav states needed to be autonomous - the collapse of the forced and oppressive Greater Serbia. Kosovo is 90% Albanian , the Serbs are only 10% or less of the population - a minority which is not entitled to continue to rule Kosovo. The Serbs have practiced ethnic clensing and have treated minorities and other ethnic groups like scum, and this is the result> what else can be expected. For those of you who make comparisons with the Canada/Quebec situation - you don't know your history and what is going on in the world- there are no similarities.
  47. Bill H from London, Canada writes: Kurtis Smith makes a good point. The US is always happy to support the emergence of tiny new nations along ethnic and linguistic lines -- all in the name of individual freedons. Remember the civil war of the 1860s? The US is very good at double standards.
  48. Gardiner Westbound from Canada writes:

    Will NATO bomb Toronto the next time Quebec separatists kick up a fuss?
  49. Al B from Toronto, Canada writes: M Warren from Ottawa, Canada writes: 'An Independent Kosovo justifies an Independent Quebec or Alberta in the realm of International law'

    Then your knowledge of international law is nil.
  50. Paul Jones from Kitchener, Canada writes: this is a disgusting, illegal, dangerous precedent. And I, for one, am not impressed with the actions of our 'leaders' on this file.
    Blood will flow from this decision, and we seem to be completly fine with that.
  51. Howard Beale from Canada writes: People everywhere just got to be free. If Canada didn't exist, it wouldn't be created. It's time for the various regions of Canada to consider reorganizing along more logical lines. The present composition of Canada is a remnant of the decisions of European imperialists.
  52. M Warren from Ottawa, Canada writes: Al B from Toronto, Canada writes: M Warren from Ottawa, Canada writes: 'An Independent Kosovo justifies an Independent Quebec or Alberta in the realm of International law'

    Then your knowledge of international law is nil.
    ---------------------------------------------
    Let me be more precise then: The use of the principle of self-determination to justify a independence declaration can be used by anyone; if it works for Kosovo, it works for Quebec, it works for Alberta, it works for anyone.
  53. vlad stanisic from Canada writes: Mr. Einstein, “Forced and oppressive Greater Serbia&8221; ??? Where are you coming from? The cloaks of Nazis or Kominterna Bolsheviks, they loved to use this terminology invented by good ol&8217; A-H empire. What you are saying is distortion of facts to put it nicely, or in simple words, a blatant lie.
  54. Shawn Bao from Montreal, Canada writes: The speed of Muslimizing in Europe is increasing. Just like the US is Latinizing. A pan-albania, i.e., albanians in Albania, Macedonia, and Kosovo, together with African muslim immigrants in west Europe, the anthrop- and geo-political map of Europe will soon see dramistic changes. The west has being prospered based on basic principles of mordern democratic society, and will doom because of that.

    It will also create chain reactions in other regions across the world have similar problems, Basque in Spain, ethnic groups in Netherlands, Kurds in Iraq and Turkey, Chechenya in Russia, Taiwan in China, .... hmm, this world is going to be noisy again.
  55. Tim Bryson from Claresholm, AB., Canada writes: Unilateral succession can only be recognized if the breakaway region can point to a history of repression. Kosovo can, as can the Ukraine. Certainly Palestine can as well. For Quebec to break away, they would have to win a referendum, then get the rest of Canada to agree to it. This would require a constitutional amendment, as there is nothing in the Canada Act that provides for the breakup of Canada. Although Quebec had suffered some economic and cultural injustices prior to 1960, in no way can they be compared to what the Ukrainians went thrugh at ther hands of Stalin, the Kosavars at the hands of Milosevic, the Palestinians at the hands of the Israelis, etc.

    The radical fringe of te PQ and BQ will offer santimonious proclaimations about the right to Quebec self-determination, the feds will try to buy off the voters of Quebec will a few more tax dollars, Charest will express his appreciation, the radicals will go back to their cafes and things will settle down for another decade or so.
  56. Jack Robertson from Toronto, Canada writes: In the interests of real humanitarianism, Canada should admit as immigrants all of Kosovo's ethnic Serbs and fast-track their applications for Canadian citizenship. They would provide a good counterbalance to many of the bogus 'refugees' and other undesirables that Canada has admitted over the past four decades.
  57. M Warren from Ottawa, Canada writes: Howard Beale from Canada writes: People everywhere just got to be free. If Canada didn't exist, it wouldn't be created. It's time for the various regions of Canada to consider reorganizing along more logical lines. The present composition of Canada is a remnant of the decisions of European imperialists.
    ---------------------------------
    ...or the remnant of the decisions of Roman Senators, or King Arthur, or who knows what else. And, just whose 'logical lines' should Canada be reorganized. While I sympathize with your perspective, the same logic could terminate with more fractures than you could shake a fibula at. Hey, I think that the major holdings of many multinational corporations should be seized and nationalized, and the capital of Canada should be moved to the geographic centre (Winnipeg). That's reorganization, too! So, just what kind of 'reorganization' are you referring to?
  58. Al B from Toronto, Canada writes: M Warren, read the first paragraph of Tim Bryson's post.
  59. Tim Bryson from Claresholm, AB., Canada writes: I don't want to sound paranoid, but how long will it be before the US offers Kosavo an economic aid package tied to the establishment of a military base with a status of forces agreement.

    The Russians will complain, and all the right wingnuts will wonder what problem the Russians could possibly have with US forces that close to their frontier.
  60. Jalali Saragli from Cape Verde writes: The stupidity of EU and USA shines once more. I have not read the official Canadian reaction but I hope Canada is wiser and does not recognize Kosovo. If yes, Quebec's time will come soon.

    BTW, if Canada does the stupid mistake to recognize Kosovo, then Canada should recognize Taiwan as well. If not, oh Canada, double-faced-sob.
  61. Howard Beale from Canada writes: M Warren, I am referring to the formation of independent countries. The composition of these new independent countries would be determined by the regions themselves. Would an independent NL want to form a country with the Maritime Provinces? That would be for them to decide. Would Alberta and Saskatchewan want to form a nation? That would be up to the residents of those provinces to determine.

    Just because something might initially be messy doesn't mean that it shouldn't be done or couldn't be done.
  62. Al B from Toronto, Canada writes: Kosovo is really nowhere near the Russian border. I doubt the US would want to have a base there.
  63. Jalali Saragli from Cape Verde writes: 'Shawn Bao' that state you mentioned is called FYROM not Macedonia. It is a piece of land occupied by Albanians and various Slavs artificially named 'Macedonia' by the communist Yugoslavia. Nothing to do with the Macedonias who were Greek (like Manitoban's are Canadians, etc). Please keep your names and facts straight.
  64. Al B from Toronto, Canada writes: Jalali Saragli. You realize I'm sure there is a huge debate whether ancient Macedonians were Greeks. Certainly the classical Greeks did think of them as outsiders.
  65. Jean Malice from Calgary, Canada writes: Kosovo should be an example for western nations: different fertility rates led to transform a majority into a minority and led to land being stolen from them.
  66. Jalali Saragli from Cape Verde writes: Sorry for the multi-posting folks but here is another puiece of info that you might want to have and maybe digest in trying to make sense of this stupidity:

    90% of the illegal drug trafficing/manufacturing in Europe goes through Turkey-FYROM-Kosovo-Albania and then it is disributed across to Italy and then the rest of Western Europe. You see now why an independent Kosovo is so important? It is the missing link to the chain of distribution.
  67. Yury K from Scarborough, Canada writes: OK, here is the breaking news:

    Abkhazia and South Ossetia have just announced that they will appeal to the UN for the recognition of their independence!!!

    And as a matter of fact, Georgis has just announced that it will NOT recognize independence of Kosovo

    So what is the next? A few hundred ex-military Serbs crossed the border of Kosovo ... so far, they are not fighting with the Albanian police but ... and some of the Serbs are ex-habitants of Kosovo, driven away by albanians from Kosovo as the result of the cleansing, carried by Albanians against Serbs and Romas

    The Pandora box has been opened! Congratulations to the US, NATO, and EU
  68. joy division from Canada writes: 15 years ago skeptics expressed disdain for SFOR, IFOR and KFOR

    Today, Slovenia, Macedonia, Bosnia, Croatia and now Kosovo all have their eyes on NATO and EU membership or are on the verge of becoming members of one or the other organisation

    Today those same skeptics who questioned our actions back then can be found questioning our actions in Afghanistan

    and the beat goes on....
  69. John Smith from Toronto, Canada writes: All 10000 Albanian 'refugees' in Canada should be immediately sentback to Kosovo, to continue being there on social assistance.
  70. M Warren from Ottawa, Canada writes: Tim Bryson from Claresholm, AB., Canada writes: Unilateral succession can only be recognized if the breakaway region can point to a history of repression. Kosovo can, as can the Ukraine. Certainly Palestine can as well. For Quebec to break away, they would have to win a referendum, then get the rest of Canada to agree to it. This would require a constitutional amendment, as there is nothing in the Canada Act that provides for the breakup of Canada. Although Quebec had suffered some economic and cultural injustices prior to 1960, in no way can they be compared to what the Ukrainians went thrugh at ther hands of Stalin, the Kosavars at the hands of Milosevic, the Palestinians at the hands of the Israelis, etc.
    -----------------------------------------
    Anything can be used to justify unilateral succession. Speaking from the perspective of Canadian law is one thing, yes, but adherence to it by a secessionist movement is not needed for it to actually happen in a scenario where it is backed by the force of arms. You're talking about a legislative process being defined, I'm talking about political power growing from the barrel of a gun. The leaders of Nigeria's Eastern Region, for instance, removed themselves completely from 'process' and declared Biafran independence unilaterally. Jefferson Davis did not ring up Abraham Lincoln about anything. It's unlikely to happen that way with Quebec or Alberta, to be sure, but my point is that petty amendments to a national constitution are not required for a secession to occur anywhere.
  71. Chris Lalonde from Singapore writes: It's sad to see the break up of a country but given the history of suppression, violence and ethnic cleansing it's hard to condemn it either. Hopefully, there will be more peace in this region....
  72. Al B from Toronto, Canada writes: Jalali Saragli from Cape Verde writes: '90% of the illegal drug trafficing/manufacturing in Europe goes through Turkey-FYROM-Kosovo-Albania '

    Problem is Turkey and Macedonia don't share a border.
  73. Jalali Saragli from Cape Verde writes: 'Al B from Toronto, Canada writes: Jalali Saragli from Cape Verde writes: '90% of the illegal drug trafficing/manufacturing in Europe goes through Turkey-FYROM-Kosovo-Albania '

    Problem is Turkey and Macedonia don't share a border. '

    Oh, it does go through Bulgaria's southerm part but since it is now part of EU it became a hash-hash fact....
  74. Inform Yourself from Canada writes: Jack Robertson, please inform yourself a little more about European culture before talking about it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illyria
    Kosovars who are ethnic Albanian's, who are successors of Illyrians, have lived in that territory since before 4th century BC, way before the Slavic tribes came from Northern Europe and settled in that part of the world. 2M people in the 21st century in south-central Europe with very distinct culture and language declare themselves independent from a state that has expropriated their land, prosecuted and performed ethnic cleansing on them for the past century. It would be more problematic to keep the Kosovars under this state by force. Anyone who has not experienced prosecution for generations in their own home or country and speaks against Kosovo's independence is passing an ignorant and hypocritical judgment.
  75. Andrei Vidal from United States writes: Well, the genetic evidence proves that Serbs and Albanians are both closely related and neither are genetically related to non-Serbian Slavs, suggesting that both are the descendents of Illyrians; the difference is that one group was Slavicized and the other was not. This is comparable to the recent findings that the Irish and the English are about 90% the same, genetically. So, Serbs are as native to the Balkans as are Albanians. Furthermore, Albanians are traced to an Illyrian tribe that lived not in Kosovo but in present-day Albania. Albanians are relative newcomers to Kosovo.
  76. Jalali Saragli from Cape Verde writes: Inform Yourself from Canada writes: ...'Albanian's, who are successors of Illyrians, have lived in that territory since before 4th century BC, way before the Slavic tribes came from Northern Europe and settled in that part of the world. 2M people in the 21st...'

    Oh, don't go to this argument because:

    1) Demographics of Kosovo have changed because the birth ratio within the Albanian community is ... stratospheric.

    2) If we start talking about 'who owned what' centuries ago then we'll have to change every map we currently know of. Illyrians are now gone; many-many centuries ago.

    3) Wikipedia? Hmmm, that is a very 'serious' source of information. 'I read it on the internet so it must be right!'
  77. M Warren from Ottawa, Canada writes: Next step: The Soviet army, yes, Soviet, has been rebuilt. The anthem has been restored, the hammer & sickle flies on Russian ships again. There will be a walkout at the UN, and Soviet intervention.

    NATO & the G7 have miscalculated, badly.
  78. X. T. from Canada writes: David Simon from Canada writes: Where are the Kosovo Serbs going to go? Will Serbia be able to take them in?
    ---------------------------------
    Not to worry. Send PMSH there and they will have 'a nation inside of a nation'.
  79. John Smith from Toronto, Canada writes: This Comments should be FULLY moderated.
  80. Pythagoras2 Samos from Toronto, Canada writes: The Muslimization of Europe...please do not forget, 'JE ME SOUVIENS' should mean something to many...next thing that will happen is Van City will become Xiancouver City, just b/c a city or region develops a population outnumbering the host, it SHOULD NOT BE THE OPPORTUNITY TO INDEPENDENCE. Throughout history, people have always moved for better life. Fleeing oppression, assimilation through steady and silent independence but love for their new found pariotism should be the new order. Yes, Albanian Serbs have been marginalized,but let's not forget 400 years of Turkish Ottoman torture. This will only be the beginning, of the Domino effect. Putin's fears are valid and is only acting for the better of Europe and NAmerica.
  81. Al B from Toronto, Canada writes: Andrei Vidal, the problem with those genetic studies is that the subjects have been heavily 'contaminated'. Take the case of the Irish-English. That 90% similarities are the results of the last few hundred years of interbreeding. It says nothing about how different they were 500 hundred years ago. Let alone 1500 years ago.
  82. Chris E. from vancouver, Canada writes: The next state to declare independence should be the Punjab. The Sikhs are a nation.

    Following that, the Kurds could carve out a homeland in Turkey and Northern Iraq and Iran.

    Nationalism is on the rise everywhere. Minorities living extra-territorially should make sure their homeland passports are kept up to date, as they may be asked by their hosts to voluntarily repatriate themselves.
  83. Mike Sumners from Ontario, Canada writes: The Albanians may be 'secular muslims' (whatever that is...) but their big brothers from Saudi Arabia, Pakistan and other muslim countries now have a new back entrance to Europe.
  84. Leo Geiger from Canada writes: You can only draw analogies with Kosovo by concentrating on the very few things that are the same as Quebec (a potential unilateral declaration of independence) and ignoring the very many things that are completely different.

    It's a weak form of argument. I expect the BQ/PQ to make it (weak arguments are their bread and butter after all) but that doesn't make it valid.
  85. Pythagoras2 Samos from Toronto, Canada writes: If land is always the problem, and God only knows Canada has lots of it to spare...Nunavut is under populated and the World Powers, Russia, US are increasing there prowl for grabbing our lands...I nominate and dedicate a few areas for free and even offer my tax dollars to support relocating the Albanian Serbs, Palestinians or Hebrews of the Middle East to the North of Canada. They all have familliarity with weaponry and would be the perfect candidates to monitor our North, but most importantly, I think the cold has a very effective result in taming heated passions. Free land up north, come and get it, set up your Mosque, Church, Temple...as long as you can preserve Canadian Sovereignty, oh yeah we also offer dual citizenship.
  86. Polar Bear from Iceberg, Canada writes: The British have a tradition of screwing up everything they touch - they left the world in chaos as their Empire shrunk. And they are a part of NATO. I wonder what the Irish think now? They should have announced succession too!
  87. Jalali Saragli from Cape Verde writes: Pythagoras2: dual citizenship?

    I have 4 citizenships and 4 passports...!

    I can declare with pride that 'I am (ahem) Canadian'

    I think I'll go get me a new citizenship soon ... improve my 'multicultural' portfolio.
  88. A A from Mississauga, Canada writes: Kosovo was routinely opressed by Serbs. Especially since WWII, through 50-ies and 60-ies until Tito put a stop to by removing Rankovic, the head of serbian opression at the time; a name well known among Kosovo Albanians. After that ugly episode, Kosovo got through 70-ies what one would call a normal recognition and arts and education started to take a hold along with industry. However, as soon as Tito died that all came to an abrupt end with concentrated effort from all elements of Serbian society. They went on to influence the rest of Yugoslav peoples to start hating Albanians as much as they did. That did not work and Serbian nationalism only grew in its frustration and desparation. Eventually, they started hating others as much as they hated Albanians. And then 90-ies came and hope we all know how many wars Serbs started.

    Well deserved independence.
  89. Alastair james Berry from Nanaimo BC, Canada writes: Perhaps it's time to consider a Proud Independant and Free

    NEWFOUNDLAND AND LABRADOR..............or/and

    A Proud Independant and Free QUEBEC..............and/or out West

    A Proud Independant and Free CASCADIA..........

    If tiny Iceland can do it and survive with a standard of living better than Canada's, surely our potentially independent states with their massive natural resources could do MUCH BETTER?

    With so many malcontents 'hived off' into their own 'play pens' our Ottawa government would have a far easier and more relaxed work load!
  90. Jalali Saragli from Cape Verde writes: 'Polar Bear from Iceberg, Canada writes: The British have a tradition of screwing up everything they touch - they left the world in chaos as their Empire shrunk. And they are a part of NATO. I wonder what the Irish think now? They should have announced succession too!'

    ...and the Scotish, and the Welsh and the Cornwallians and the, Northumbrians and the East Anglians,...and the Canadians/Australians/Kiwis (not the fruit) and all those saps that have the Queen of England as their Head of State. The English have always been big hypocrites screwing up everything and everybody since the 18th century. They did it with the break up of yugoslavia, they are doing it again with Kosovo.
  91. tito broz from Kenya writes: jALALI You hit the nail straight into head
    90% of the illegal drug trafficing/manufacturing in Europe goes through Turkey-FYROM-Kosovo-Albania and then it is disributed across to Italy and then the rest of Western Europe. You see now why an independent Kosovo is so important? It is the missing link to the chain of distribution.
    Jewish america interests lies right there, make more illegal money ,sponsor the wars outside which are always cheaper then in own country and come at the end as :'LIBERATORS' , only idiots brain washed by CNN jewish propaganda do not see that...
  92. Winter Wonderland from North of 40, Canada writes:

    If Jack Layton had his way, this never would have happened.
  93. A M from Canada writes: How long before they demand closer ties with Albania? What will happen if they try to join the country of Albania next?
  94. CONSERVATIVE VOICE OF REASON CENTRAL ONTARIO from Canada writes: John Smith from Toronto, Canada writes: All 10000 Albanian 'refugees' in Canada should be immediately sentback to Kosovo, to continue being there on social assistance.
    Posted 17/02/08 at 12:14 PM EST | =================================================================Wonder how many so-called ''refugees'' from the Balkans are in reality War Criminals who came here crying, claiming they had to flee in the middle of the night, no passports, a pregnant wife in tow and a couple of kids and Canada took them in.

    The Balkans were in the middle of chaos and WWI started in Sarajevo; WW2 lasted longer thanks to some of those Balkan citizens who cozied up to the Nazis...Now that little trouble-maker, ex-Yugoslavia, is again in the middle of a worse nightmare... WW3 or WW4. Don't expect Afghanistan to remain a priority for very long...After all, why is our prime minister so quiet about Kosovo???
    He'll be caught between a rock and a hard place... cannot possibly follow the US to Kosovo...

    The EU troops serving under the NATO whatever in Afghanistan will be called to Kosovo when all heck breaks lose in that little whatever....

    -
  95. tito broz from Kenya writes: A A from Mississauga, Canada writes: Kosovo was routinely opressed by Serbs.
    there another supporter of infamous 'Skender beg SS division'. albanians do not have many national heroes but this one is the most famous there, His brigades were even admired by Hitlers SS troops .
    His cruelty was well known; his favourite method of torture was taking a long sharpened pole and throwing Serbs on it , entering through the rear end and coming out of the head....
    viva albania
  96. Steve C from Canada writes: 'Three plagues, three contagions, threaten the world:

    1 - The first is the plague of nationalism.
    2 - The second is the plague of racism.
    3 - The third is the plague of religious fundamentalism.

    All three share one trait, a common denominator -- an aggressive, all-powerful, total irrationality. A mind touched by such a contagion is a closed mind, one-dimensional, monothematic, spinning round one subject only - its enemy.' - Ryszard Kapuscinski

    'nuff said.
  97. Pythagoras2 Samos from Toronto, Canada writes: NEW MOVIE...Flashback...2001, US aiding Croats and Albanian Yugos in battling Milosevic led Serbia, the warring parties, are of no interest to the US public especially since shortly in the midst of this campaign the TwinTowers are knocked down. The battles finish leaders and there followers are captured tried and died. (oh yeah just like Iraq, a card game ID was alse created, Milosevic as an Ace)...FORWARD ...2008, FYROM has declared independence, Croatia is independent, and today, KOSOVO? is declaring independence...kids, the bigger picture here is the US, and the references of Britain touch this head on, DIVIDE & CONQUER, the US is setting itself in diminishing the Union & most importantly Russia's power...get ready for the US invasion. But hey the US will again create a diversion...1st Black Prez elected, then if it needs time again...1st Black Prez assassinated, what can be bigger in the US than the TwinTowers...you guessed it MillionMan march creating havoc in the streets of the US...at the same time Europe is prime for the picking with chaos...Comming Soon
  98. Jalali Saragli from Cape Verde writes: OK, I do not want to blame Jewish people or anyone else (race related characterization). I'm just saying that the bulk of the drug trafficing in Europe goes through this corridor all the way to Adriatic Sea and across to Italy. This is THE major highway folks and the Albanian mafia has always been the gatekeepers of this highway during the last 15 years. Now, Kosovo under Serbian control was an issue. After total contro by Albanians now is 'let the good times flow'! Economics 101. Oil and drugs make this world go round-and-round.
  99. Old Fart from Edmonton, Canada writes: Stude Ham from Outremont, Canada writes: 'just what the world needed... another tiny little state of a few people unable to get along with their neighbours.

    europe at its worst.'

    Sounds a lot like Quebec to me.
  100. M Warren from Ottawa, Canada writes: In two or three days, the big issue will no longer be of Kosovo's independence, but of Eastern Europe's. Bulgaria has today fallen into line with Cyprus, Romania, and Slovakia, all of which have now told the EU they will NOT recognize Kosovo.

    Russia is declaring in the most emphatic terms that they will block it in Security Council if necessary, terming it 'Illegal and Immoral' (souce: BBC). My hunch is that Russia will back up these sentiments with more than words...
  101. Jalali Saragli from Cape Verde writes: Hey all, just read about a blast in N. Kosovo.
    Let the 'fun' begin! :-(
  102. X. T. from Canada writes: John Smith from Toronto, Canada writes: This Comments should be FULLY moderated.
    -----------------------------
    No, it should be CLOSED. haha
  103. The Great Gazoo from Toronto, Canada writes: .

    While Denmark is burning the foolish Eurocrats are busy facilitating the birth of Greater Albania.

    And while the poor Euro family can barely afford their 1.3 kids, the Eurocrats are feverishly shoveling aid to construct a Muslim Greater Albania. Kosovo-Albania: the poorest area in Europe with the highest birthrate supported primarily by Eurocrat financial largesse.

    Something is rotten in the State of Denmark.

    *
  104. Jalali Saragli from Cape Verde writes: Here is another example of recent EU stupidity. Think of Turkey. None wants Turkey as a full EU member - none! But, they say to Turkey: 'hey, if you want to become a member (dream on) you will have to adopt democratic principles like us, blah, blah, blah'. Sure! says Turkey that ahs a fundamentalist (not secular) muslim government. We will now abolish the law that does not allow women to cover their heads (muslim tradition) at the Turkish universities. Since last week, this is the new law there. So, what did EU do? Instead of fostering secularism, they go ahead and support fundametalism. And all this for what? For never accepting Turkey? Shooting their own foot. Guess who is mostly behind this... hint, think of big EU island....
  105. Voice of Reason from Ottawa, Canada writes: Tell it to the countless Serb Christians who died at the hands of Muslim invaders so very long ago.
  106. Winter Wonderland from North of 40, Canada writes:

    Voice of reason------did you know that Ontario is demographically poised to become a Muslim province well within the next 30 years? Did you know that forms of Sharia law are being practiced in Toronto,and we do nothing about it?
  107. D. B. Cooper from Vancouver, Canada writes: Now that Kosovo has been recognized as independent (and propped up with troops) by the EU and etc., Northern Cyprus will also be recognized. Right? Same situation, isn't it? Orthodox Christian majority tries to eliminate Muslim minority by force, foreign power intervenes, country partitioned? Am I missing something? Well, of course I'm being sarcastic; the difference is obvious. In Kosovo the intervening power was the US and Western Europe ('us' thus 'right') and in Cyprus the intervening power was Turkey ('not us' thus 'wrong'). Someone earlier pointed out the truth of the situation - whether a new country is allowed to split off has nothing to do with morality, the facts of the situation, or international law. Realpolitik, along with a good dose of 'how the various governments involved happen to feel today (and their relative power)' is the deciding factor.

    Anyway, in all seriousness, I believe in self-determination, so here's to independent Kosovo! And here's to allowing northern Kosovo to split off too and rejoin Serbia!
  108. Anuradha Bose from writes: Anotehr candidate for the world's charity!
  109. Sam Patel from Canada writes: The last chapter of the 1999 Kosovo War comes to pass. Way to go! Maybe Serbia can get on with building a modern nation instead of focusing on territories and battles they lost 700 years ago. Those Serbs living in Pristina better start taking Albanian lessons and preparing to convert to Islam. Haha
  110. C. B. from Canada writes: About a decade ago, Serbs started to do a genocide of Kosovars. In order to prevent this from occuring again, or at least to make it more difficult, they decide to become independant from the Serbs.
    Here, in Canada, some anglo-canadians object to Kosovo's independance. Is it because they want to encourage genocides? Probably, considering the various genocides that English-Canada has perpetrated, starting with the Beothuks, up to the 'residential schools'.
  111. A A from Mississauga, Canada writes: It's funny how readily people accept whatever is served. Two myths that require demolishing.

    1. Albanian Mafia - so ok, they have criminals. Now, how the hell can they be a country. That seems to be the logic of some of the people here but mostly disgruntled Serbs. Yet, to my memory in last 30 years or more there is only one prime minister killed by an organized crime and the country is ... LOL

    2. Albanians will 'conquer' the rest of Europe. -- Now, this is the story Serbs were selling 10, 20, 30, 40 years ago. Strangely, Kosovo Albanians decided to stay in Kosovo. Just like in Canada, there is less than 800k of muslims (that's like not even 1%), yet the fear mongering machine from the known corners is in full swing. Pathetic.
  112. Nick Wilson from Toronto, Canada writes: If Kosovars are not afraid of independance, I don't understand what Quebecers are afraid of. Their situation is 1000 times better than Kosovo and Quebec' independance would be a walk in the park in comparison to Kosovo. Basically, Quebec separation from Canada would simply amount to a mega accounting transaction (How do we split the federal gvmt assets and liabilities ? ). What so scaring about that Quebecers ? I'm asking because those Quebecers who voted NO only did so on economic grounds, not because they are attached to Canada. Since it's been well documented that an orderly process to secession is very likely, there's nothing to fear for both Quebecers and Canadians. Refer to the book ' Breaking Point' about the 1995 referendum. It clearly shows that the provinces (Ontario had set-up a nogociating team), the Private Council, The Bank of Canada were prepared to negociate when it became a real possibility that the YES was going to win.
  113. AK S from Calgary, Canada writes: How would we feel if Quebec announced it was separating and Russia immediately declared their support? we would say'stay out of this, it is none of your business'.
  114. J B from Canada writes: The fact that the US is backing the independence of Kosovo should be an automatic indication that something is wrong. Multi-ethnic, socialist Yugoslavia was once a regional industrial power and economic success. In the two decades before 1980, annual GDP growth averaged 6.1%, medical care was free, the rate of literacy was 91% and life expectancy was 72 years. But after a decade of Western economic ministrations (from the IMF) and a decade of disintegration, war, boycott and embargo, the economies of the former Yugoslavia were prostrate, their industrial sectors dismantled.
    The Reagan administration had targeted the Yugoslav economy in order to promote a 'quiet revolution to overthrow Communist governments and parties while reintegrating the countries of Eastern Europe into a market-oriented economy. Following the initial phase of macro-economic reform in 1980, industrial growth plummeted to 2.8% in the 1980-87 period, plunging to zero in 1987-88 and to a negative 10% growth rate by 1990. This process was accompanied by the piecemeal dismantling of the Yugoslav welfare state, with all the predictable social consequences.
    IMF 'shock therapy' began in January 1990. Although inflation had eaten away at earnings, the IMF ordered that wages be frozen at their mid November 1989 levels. Prices continued to rise unabated, and real wages collapsed by