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Flaherty denies trying to jinx Ontario

KAREN HOWLETT

Globe and Mail Update

Latest comment posted at 4:55 PM EDT 03/03/08

Federal finance minister and Ontario premier stick to their guns in ongoing dispute over the province's economy ...Read the full article

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  1. Michael Sharp from Victoria, Canada writes:

    Think Ireland, McGuinty, not Quebec.
  2. Elmo Harris from Niagara, Canada writes: Who will best serve Ontario's interests? Flaherty, whose wacky-right ideology dumped Ontario into a deficit AND THEN HID IT UNDER THE RUG? Or, McGuinty, who got stuck with the Conservative mess, and eventually got us out of trouble?

    I'm going with McGuinty. Sound fiscal management. Mature leadership.
  3. spicydoc reconstituted from broken parts, Canada writes:

    I'm getting the big picture now.

    Ontario's economy is going to hades in a handbasket, and nobody can do a thing about it. Flaherty and McGuinty are jockeying for blame assignment, not solutions (there aren't any).

    Tory was thrown under a bus INTENTIONALLY; methinks everybody in the PC/CPC knew Ontario was doomed, and were happy to pound McGuinty for a few more years. (the school thing was a 'noble' way to make Tory's campaign die).

    The CPC have written off most of Ontario--it's irretrievable in more ways than one.

    Flaherty is goofy but actually quite smart; Dalton seems 'okay' but actually has no clue what to do next.

    Fun fun fun...
  4. so, what from USA, Canada writes: We should loan Flaherty out to the world because it seems he knows how to fix the economic woes of any country/state/province/town...who knew? Is this a noble prize in economics type of event we're witnessing? Flaherty for president of the world bank?

    How did Canada and the world get by without Flaherty knowing how to fix everyone's economic issues. I'm sleeping better tonight.
  5. Ryan Ginger from ottawa, Canada writes: Maybe McGuinty could lower corporate taxes if Flaherty would first adjust the transfer payments to other provinces. Why not let Alberta, for once, carry the other 'have not' provinces and allow Ontario the luxury of lowering its taxes.
  6. Robert Loblaw from Canada, Canada writes: Elmo Harris - Really Elmo, are they paying you to say this? McGuinty has done less for Ontario than any premier in its history. If you consider doing nothing as 'sound fiscal management' then you shouldn't be upset or surprised when the provinces economy tanks and your taxes go through the roof.

    I guess you didn't mind being tapped for a health tax that went into general revenues either.

    How about some provincial incentives to help Niagara Falls, which suffering due to the high dollar? Hasn't hit you yey Elmo? Don't worry, it will, unless of course you are 16 years old or on pension, in which case it won't matter.
  7. Michael Sharp from Victoria, Canada writes:

    Actually, and I'm not that conversant in Ontario provincial politics, wasn't it the finance minister after Flaherty that ran deficits?
    A woman, I believe.

    Didn't Flaherty himself run surpluses?
  8. Michael Sharp from Victoria, Canada writes:

    And...

    Didn't the Cadscam scandal take a lovely turn?
    Suddnely, it's the LPC who squirm.
  9. Steven Koning from Bloomfield, ON, Canada writes: McGuinty could have lowered business taxes by raising the PST by 2% when the feds lowered the GST by 2 %. But no, McGuinty hasn't got the guts to raise his own taxes and be held accountable by the Ontario voters, instead he wants the feds to bail him out so he can spend their money and not have to face his own electorate. McGutless McGuinty, it's a pattern just look at the Caledonia occupation, and his caving in to the health industry unions, the public service unions and the teaching unions. NcGuinty was elected by 40% of a 50% turn-out, or about 2 out of 10 voters in the province of Ontario. Some mandate to fight Ottawa with...
  10. Catherine Wilkie from Canada writes: Harper and Flaherty must have decided that giving Ontario a kick every now and again, plays well to their support base.
    But, we're beginning to see how things are done in the Conservative tent. No one is surprised.
    That campaign promise of restoring respect and harmony within the provinces was so much Tory rhetoric.
    The talent of the Tories is their use of the dirty trick manual.
  11. Catherine Wilkie from Canada writes: Flaherty and Harper seem to forget that they are elected and not appointed by their blue blood.
    Ah well. They will be reminded soon.
  12. spicydoc reconstituted from broken parts, Canada writes:

    Michael Sharp--

    Flaherty was long gone by the time Ecker/Eves left 6 bill behind.

    The left like to confuse history a bit--just like burnt-out GTA yuppies who ALL claim to have been at Woodstock or Ohio State.

    Maybe it's the drugs. Maybe they can't help being libellous liars. Who knows?

    I don't listen to those crackpots and their hippie hallucinations anymore.
  13. Catherine Wilkie from Canada writes: Folks of Ontario would probably rate Ecker and Flaherty as equals in their abysmal handling of the Ontario economy.
  14. Elmo Harris from Niagara, Canada writes: spicydoc reconstituted from broken parts, Canada writes:

    I'm getting the big picture now.

    Ontario's economy is going to hades in a handbasket, and nobody can do a thing about it. Flaherty and McGuinty are jockeying for blame assignment, not solutions (there aren't any)... blah... blah... blah

    No, Shawn, Ontario's economy WAS a mess until McGuinty salvaged it from the scrap heap left by Flaherty.

    .
  15. Liberals Steal from Canada writes: McGuinty is BobRaeII.
    It's that simple.
  16. Robert Loblaw from Canada, Canada writes: McGuinty is so terrified of running a larger deficit or increasing taxes that every move he makes takes the province on step closer to both. He has no idea how to run a government and proved it in his first term.

    He doesn't realize that he'd actually increase tax revenues by lowering taxes which would attract more industry and employ more people. Initially there would be a transition period where revenues might soften a bit, but eventually the province would reap the benefit. Problem is Dalton can't see past tomorrow, and can't sell the public anything.

    If he had any parts he would have increased the provincial sales tax to match the decrease in the GST, and used the money to support Ontario's cities, infrastructure and industry. It's much easier however to do nothing - as he did with the coal burning hydro plants.
  17. Robert Loblaw from Canada, Canada writes: Elmo Harris - A great response Elmo, and just what was expected. Intelligent discourse obviously isn't part of your repertoire.

    It must be embarrassing to have sand kicked in your face all the time.
  18. Fred Draper from Kingston, Canada writes: Michael sharp and spicy, it's good to see your sensible posts.

    Yes, the Ontario economy was so disastrous that Dalton had to spend $23 billion a year more just to keep the surplus from exploding. Now he's stuck with it.

    Dalton McGuinty.. first premier of a have not Ontario. If the shoe fits, wear it, baby!
  19. J Taylor from Central AB, Canada writes: Ryan Ginger suggests that AB carry the load that Ontario has 'carried for so long'. Ryan, it is very obvious that you do not take the time to gather the information before spouting off nonsense. Alberta has paid more then double on a per capita basis into the program then Ontario has paid. On an absolute basis, AB paid 15,000,000,000 (billion) in 2005 while Ontario paid only 17,000,000,000. Seems to me that we are doing our share and it will likely be shown that in 2006 and 2007, the amount AB pays in will grow and likely be more the Ontario in absolute $'s.

    McGuinty needs to fix his own house and not blame the Feds for his inaction on teh economy and what he needs to do to make the business enviroment attractive for new business and for companies to grow.

    His taxes are what is driving companies to lower tax jurisdiction.
  20. Catherine Wilkie from Canada writes: Ontario is and has always been a stalwart province of the federation. Ontarians respect other provinces and should expect the reciprocal response.
    Harper and Flaherty are playing divisive, mean-spirited politics.
    Shouldn't they be busy restoring the federal coffers to when they took the reins?
  21. Nick Wilson from Toronto, Canada writes: It's too bad the G&M didn't open a thread for the new chapter of the Chuck Cadman affair. The more we know about about it, the clearer it becomes. It was obviously a bear trap set-up by the Conservatives and idiot Liberals eagerly jumped on it so desperate they were to get a bit of a political free lunch. The irony is that Cadman's wife will be running for the Conservatives in the upcoming election. The Liberals jumped on that fake scandal like dogs who've been starving for months. And now the whole thing is returning against the Liberals. Harper, you're a genious.
  22. Don Jenkins from Canada writes: You know someone's got a pocket full of meat puppets when they compliment each other on 'sensible' posts, and those posts themselves are conspiracy theories and raving insults. LOL.
  23. Catherine Wilkie from Canada writes: From the Conservative posters here, it is obvious that Ontario will continue be treated to unfairly by the Harper gov't.
  24. Will Hoaccio from Toronto, Canada writes: J Taylor from Central AB, Canada writes: 'McGuinty needs to fix his own house and not blame the Feds for his inaction on teh economy and what he needs to do to make the business enviroment attractive for new business and for companies to grow.'

    Okay, fair enough. What exactly should McGuinty cut first to lower taxes? Ontario already has the lowest per-capita expenditures of the provinces. So, by you're logic we should spend even less on education or health care, to compete with a province like Manitoba, who we subsidize.
  25. True North from Canada writes: Flaherty cooked the books when he was minister of finance for Ontario and left it billions of dollars in debt - he should look in the mirror and shut up. Flaherty's tirades are an excellent way to lose votes the CPC needs in Ontario to win the next election. Classic 'the buck stops somewhere else' approach of Harper's government.
  26. Go Oilers Go! from Canada writes: Flaherty needs to learn that his tone is not helping the CPC's election fortunes at all.

    Dalton needs to accept that he has no plan for Ontario and has done nothing to stimulate investment in Ontario's economy.
  27. Fred Draper from Kingston, Canada writes: True North, you should educate yourself by reading Michael sharp and Spicy's posts. Otherwise, I'd have to conclude that you're as thick as a brick.
  28. Catherine Wilkie from Canada writes: Flaherty and Harper are vetting towards the province of Ontario in a divisive way, while they campaigned on restoring provincial harmony.
    The Harper gov't seems incapable of respecting all provinces at one time. They appear to want a whipping boy.
    Poor leadership. Poor politics.
  29. Barry Johnstone from Canada writes: I think Dalton needs to be very careful here. Otherwise I'm sure Jimbo and Steve will be threatening to sue him for libel. After all everyone knows that if you disagree with Canada's new government you must be a fool, a liar, or part of a left wing conspiracy. It would, however, be quite enjoyable to listen to Jim and Steve testify under oath where they couldn't just not answer questions and give their pet sound bites. Personally I can hardly wait!
  30. spicydoc reconstituted from broken parts, Canada writes:

    Catharine--

    Let's assume that Tory won the election, and Ontario was in the same financial situation as now.

    Tell us what you think Harper/Flaherty would be saying/doing differently than now.

    Serious request--anybody else with ideas, please pitch in....
  31. John Spafford from Canada writes: So much hot air on this site. Ontario was predicted to tank years ago as companies would not buy into new technology but decided to hide behind the lousy Canadian dollar. They have been warned for years that this would bite if and when our loonie improved. Well.............it has improved and coupled with the slow down of US and other trading partners naturally we are in the tank. It is not Ontario or the feds fault these down turns happen and won't last forever. No reasonable person would expect either governments to bail us all out. Which is quite impossible. Thank god for Alberta. The dollar is remaining strong but won't when oil comes down. In the mean time a nice trip to New York City next month will cheer me up. Getting away from all this grand Canadiana also improves my headache. Not to worry and these problems are cyclical and happen routinely over the years. Good buying opportunities in banks pretty soon.
  32. Auroran Bear from Montreal, Canada writes: From what I've read, even by 2012 Ontarios corporate tax rate will be lower than where the Feds are moving theirs. Couple that with the equalization payments that Ontario contributes and Flaherty is in no position to preach.
  33. Pete H from Canada writes: Elmo Harris from Niagara, Canada writes:
    I'm going with McGuinty. Sound fiscal management. Mature leadership.
    Who are you trying to kid, you'd go with the Liberals if they stole money from you. Partisan hack.
  34. Vern McPherson from writes: Flaherty the little liar fails to mention Ontario cut busienss taxes by 3 billion last November. He also doesn't menton the report he references called the GST cuts 'unfortunate'. And he doesn't mention Ontario's desire to harmonize the PST wit hthe GSt only if the FedCOns will exempt items currently exempt under th Ontario PST regime - which the defsCOns are refusing to do.

    Flaherty also doesn't nemtion that Ontario 's debt rose by 40 % while the HarrisCOns were in power. He also doesn't mention the result of downloading of social programs to cities paid for his tax cuts and his vote candy checks.

    He also doesn't mention it has taken 5 years to get Ontario out of the deficit his former govt left us with.

    Flaherty mentions the Task Force report thinking the average citizen won't go there and attempt to understand what it says. But that is the modus here, lie and hope to get away with it by making it a BIG LIE .
  35. Vern McPherson from writes: ' Capital taxes were eliminated for Ontario's troubled manufacturers and resource industries on Jan. 1 and have been reduced 21 per cent for everyone else'

    http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20080228/mcguintytaxes080228/20080228?hub=TorontoHome

    'McGuinty also repeated his complaint that the Employment Insurance system is shortchanging Ontario workers, who he says are getting $4,000 less each than workers in other parts of the country. He also hinted after his speech that his government may be considering policy aimed at filling that gap, since Prime Minister Stephen Harper isn't moving to fix a system that is hampering the province's ability to transform unemployed workers into skilled labour. '

    the fedCOns fiddle diddle as the tax cut guys while attempting to download the 2 % GST cut to Ontario's PST rate. What could be a more underhanded and dirty scam thatn that that ?

    Watch as the fedCOns go around telling everyone that listens that they cut taxes ...................... It's a shame. They downloaded 60 billion to the provinces over the next 5 years.
  36. Will Hoaccio from Toronto, Canada writes: Look, nobody who hates the 'evil reptilian kitten eater from another planet' (probably the greatest political slur of all time) seems all that inclined to comment on how McGuinty can cut corporate taxes. Where is the money to come from? Before the inevitable rant on 'liberal patronage' and 'union-driven excess', all other provinces are equally unionized and Ontario does have the lowest expenditures per-capita.

    So, the inevitable question: Is Flaherty (or any fed) prepared to reform equalization to not blatantly abuse Ontario and -this IS radical- require more self-sufficiency from Quebec or Manitoba?

    More Radically - I would like Ontario to be broken into four separate provinces, S. Ontario, East Ontario, GTAH and N. Ontario. Ontario is too big in relation to other provinces, it forms a kind of sub-government. N. Ontario is a de facto have not province anyways. It's interests are totally different from the rest of Ontario and deserves more autonomy.
  37. scott reid from Peterborough, Canada writes: What I just don't get about this whole exchange, is why would the Conservatives want to risk further alienating Ontario voters? To be honest, I can't understand why there hasn't been a non-stop train of federal funding from Ottawa to the rest of Ontario. It would kill the Liberals. For all the political strategizing Harper does, appealing to the lowest common denominator for Ontario and getting a majority government in exchange seems to escape him.
  38. Catherine Wilkie from Canada writes: spicydoc: Flaherty is still ticked that Eves lost to McGuinty.
    Speculation is a trait of the Conservatives.
    But, I do believe that Ontario deserves to be treated fairly in federal matters, and should expect to be treated in a dignified manner.
    Flaherty is not. And if Harper isn't complicit in this, too, he should replace him.
  39. Vern McPherson from writes: Here is who the campaign of lies is working. Baird said: 'Of course, we got hit with the biggest tax increase in Canadian history and all the corporate tax cuts, which make our economy competitive, were cancelled.' http://canadianpress.google.com/article/ALeqM5i4OAxmLwlo1P_8ld08_ZgEPLkSuw He is referencing the COns bitter political defeat in 03 and the libs taking over. What he didn't mention was the 6 billion deficit he left Ontario which was unsustainable. He also didn't mention the scheduled tax cuts the Harris COns had for 2003 were cancelled in their 0203 budget and set back because economic indicators were not favorable at the time of their 02/03 budget. Read this: Personal Income Tax Reschedule completion of 20% Personal Income Tax cut 218 million Reschedule increase in Equity in Education Tax Credit rate to 20% 15 million Enrich Ontario Tax Reduction (5) (20) Corporations Tax Reschedule remaining steps of Corporate Income Tax rate cuts 11 0 Property Tax Reschedule remaining steps of Business Education Property Tax cut 14 0 Reschedule completion of Residential Education Property Tax cut 69 0 http://www.fin.gov.on.ca/english/budget/ontariobudgets/2002/paperc.html ----------Bottom of the page. Re-schedule re-schedule and re-schedule. Baird lies. All COns lie. COns = liars
  40. Fred Draper from Kingston, Canada writes: This was a very nice letter Flaherty wrote Dalton. Polite and chock full of helpful suggestions.

    Only Catherine Wilkie would see it as disrespectful.
  41. Catherine Wilkie from Canada writes: The Conservatives need to have some forward thinking for the nation. They are too complacent with their crude friends and their support.
    Flaherty isn't up to the task. And Harper is to busy with his dirty tricks to be effective.
    They are a weak government.
  42. Vern McPherson from writes: Fred Draper from Kingston, Canada writes: This was a very nice letter Flaherty wrote Dalton. Polite and chock full of helpful suggestions.
    Only Catherine Wilkie would see it as disrespectful.

    -----------------------------------------------------

    Hey fred what was the tax rate on business in 2003 when the Libs took over ? Are you going to show us where McGuinty increased it 40 % ? Or do you intend to lie some more ?
  43. Fred Draper from Kingston, Canada writes: I never lie Vern, but unlike you, I may make the odd mistake or so.

    Dalton's taxes are now, as of Jan 1, 2006, actually 75% more than what they would have been under the Cons, not 40%
  44. Vern McPherson from writes: It would seem the fiscal conditions for all of Cnaada and of Ontario are currently similar. The COns spent al the surplus and wasted billions on a useless GST cut. So much so the Finance Minister flaherty has said ......... do not look for more tax cuts in the near term because Canada can't afford them.

    Well After 5 long years of workingto erasing the hidden defiicit the HarisCOns left Ontari oand hid from view, We are in similar shape with a small surplus.

    The question is if harper/flaherty expects further tax cuts in Ontario under these conditions why is he saying no more tax cuts federally for a while ?

    If harper/flaherty really believe tax cuts produce more business activity why not cut them even more on the federal level ????

    Or was flaherty and the COns lying then and is he lying now ?
  45. John Cameron from Canada writes: Ryan Ginger from ottawa, Canada writes:>>> Maybe McGuinty could lower corporate taxes if Flaherty would first adjust the transfer payments to other provinces. Why not let Alberta, for once, carry the other 'have not' provinces and allow Ontario the luxury of lowering its taxes.>>>>

    Ontario collects taxes for Ontario only, it's the Feds who collect taxes and send the money back to other Provinces at a higher rate than to Ontario or other 'have' Provinces.

    Ontario definitely has a problem right now, almost as bad as 1975-76 when I was able to buy a car with no sales tax there and drive it back to Alberta. I guess they could try that move again to spur local car sales.
  46. Jimmee J. from Tecumseh, Canada writes: Who is this Flaherty clown? He is suppose to be representing all of the country, not pockets of it.
    He sounds like a bitter, spoiled child. Grow up sir, you are affecting thousands of Canadian workers, many who are out of work not.
  47. Catherine Wilkie from Canada writes: Flaherty, Clement, Baird...they are Harris disciples. They believed in the 'create a crisis' politics. And they left Ontario in a crisis.
    Only to reemerge on the federal scene. Harper would probably replace them if he had any depth on his bench.
  48. Ron Judd from ex Torontonian, Canada writes:

    Open Letter To The World

    Why not consider investing in Ontario? This is a place with the highest corporate and business tax in the entire country. And our education system is producing droves of philosophers who, with the exception of a few, are technologically illiterate. We have some of the strongest unions in the world who are managed by some of the shrewdest and most aggressive union bosses the labor movement has ever known. And don't worry about strikes-they always happen for the right reasons and they rarely last more than a couple of months.

    And if that isn't enough to get you all excited about investing here, we have even more great news. The cost of hydro is bound to go up and our patented anti-American, anti-big business mentality espoused by our loose cannon socialists, is sure to place us at the top of your list of possible places to invest.

    So what are you waiting for? We'll even give you a free subscription to the Toronto Star, the most left leaning newspaper in North America.
  49. Vern McPherson from writes: Details of Ontario's most current tax cuts and innovation spending since Jan 1, 2008. before all this nonsense lying by the fedCOns began:

    Economic update highlights

    Some highlights from the Ontario Liberal government’s economic update released today:

    — Eliminating the capital tax starting Jan. 1, 2008, for manufacturers.

    — A retroactive 21 per cent capital-tax rate cut for all businesses.

    — Retroactively increasing the small-business deduction threshold to $500,000.

    — $300 million over three years to expand the land-transfer tax refund for first-time home buyers to include resale homes.

    — $150 million for cattle, hog and horticultural farmers.

    — $50 million for investments in innovation.

    — $40 million to retrain and re-employ laid-off workers.

    — $30 million for tourism promotion and marketing.

    The Canadian Press
  50. L.B. MURRAY from Canada L.B. MURRAY from Canada from Hometown, Canada writes: THE HARRIS APOSTLES hard at work in our New Government of Canada, hard at work in the woodwork in so many Provinces, behind the scene, wreaking havoc,,,

    The top guy is Flaherty...

    Next.

    -
  51. karra redux from Canada writes: Get a grip if possible Elmo - as you well know but choose to ignore - your friend Chretien slashed the transfer payments to Ontario to such a level Harris had to cut the budgets of nearly every Ministry - all that to curry a few votes and ensure his legg-ah-see by gar - so, it's interesting to see the gLiberal diehards continue to slag in all the wrong places.
  52. flarity should leak an offer of fiscal smarts to Obama ? be very afraid stevie from Canada writes: Michael Sharp from Victoria, Canada writes:

    Think Ireland, McGuinty, not Quebec.
    Posted 03/03/08 at 4:42 PM EST

    Please explain ? Do you mean hire the IRA to tune up these hateful reform alliance not the FLQ ?

    Flarity : match the federal tax rate to Ontario tax rate or shut your gob !
  53. Robert Loblaw from Canada, Canada writes: Ron Judd - Good post, after which there is very little left to discuss. Too bad it falls on so many deaf partisan ears.
  54. Vern McPherson from writes: In his %hitty Falherty says he is proud of living in Ontario where he and his wife are politicians getting paid at the trough. Both of them . His wife is a Provincial MPP.

    So what does he care about disparaging the ontario economy nationally and internationally ? They don't work in the economy. Before politics flaherty was a personal injury lawyer, an ambulance chaser essentially. What are his qualifications in Finance ? The screw-up he did in Ontario ?
  55. Vern McPherson from writes: The feds cut transfer payments by a small percentage in specific areas of provincial jurisdiction, like less than 3 % in Health care. That is on the record. Harris had no business slashing the environmet Ministry 80 % and causing the deaths and mamings of hundreds of citizens in Walkerton.

    He had no busines borrowing money in the markets to finance his phoney tax cuts, increasing the provincial debt by over 40 % and then had to withdraw his business tax cuts in th 02/03 budget. And that is on the record also.

    Bring facts not lies.
  56. wayne ouellette from Canada writes: What has McGuinty done to help the troubled economy of Ontario. What has he done? He is a liberal and the only way is the liberal way. Buzz, still a liberal supporter? It does not matter what mcguinty sez or does. Ontario is STUCK with this guy for another 3 years. End of story.
  57. Nick Wilson from Toronto, Canada writes: As far as I'm concerned, the conservatives can write off Toronto and everybody in Canada would be very happy about that. Toronto Liberals arrogance know no bounds and these rascals need to be taught a good lesson. We need more of Western Canada and less of Ontario and a lot lot less of Toronto in the federal gvmt. Good job Harper, please carry on.
  58. Fred Draper from Kingston, Canada writes: We could use a man like Mike Harris (the first term) again. Twice the premier Dalton is. The man had vision, and actively promoted the province in Michigan and other states. We had years with China like GDP growth numbers.

    How did we let Dalton get away with faith based funding as the sine qua non issue in the last election.

    Thanks for nothing, John Tory.
  59. Stan L from Canada writes: Nick Wilson from Toronto, Canada writes: As far as I'm concerned, the conservatives can write off Toronto and everybody in Canada would be very happy about that. Toronto Liberals arrogance know no bounds and these rascals need to be taught a good lesson. We need more of Western Canada and less of Ontario and a lot lot less of Toronto in the federal gvmt. Good job Harper, please carry on.

    What did you get that from the Handbook? Come on idiotic posts like these are really annoying. Seriously all 2 million people in Toronto proper and the 8 million in the areas surrounding are arrogant and becuase of that we should all go bankrupt, and suffer.......are you for real? seriously or are you just a child who has been allowed to post for the evening becuase if you think that a federal finance minister best interests are served by inappropriately lipping off about the most populace province? You can crow about the west all you want, but the fact is that if Ontario is limping, you are crowing for nothing.....Good job Harper indeed.....
  60. Robert Loblaw from Canada, Canada writes: Vern McPherson - For a person who hates lies, it seems as you have no compunction about propagating one yourself. The contaminated water problem in Walkerton would have happened regardless of who was in govt. Stan and Frank Koebel who were responsible for analysing and reporting on the condition of the water to the govt. both pleaded guilty to falsifying the reports in Nov. of 2004.

    Cost cutbacks don't make people lie Vern. Suggesting that the problem was caused by the Harris govt. cost cutting is a convenient way of misleading those who can't be bothered to review the history.

    Nice try, though, but please don't give anyone a reason to call YOU a liar Vern.
  61. Vern McPherson from writes: ' Ontario’s general corporate income tax rate is reduced by up to 60% for small Canadian-controlled private corporations. Small
    businesses with assets of $10 million or less are generally
    exempt from Ontario’s capital tax. Firms with revenues
    under $10 million or total assets less than $5 million fall
    below the threshold of the corporate minimum tax.'

    http://www.sbe.gov.on.ca/ontcan/sbe/downloads/pocketguides/pocket_guide.pdf

    Page 12.

    Small business pay no tax in Ontario ??? Why would anyone opening a business not like that feature ? Did flaherty lie when he said Ontario was the 'last place to invest' ?????
  62. Vern McPherson from writes: Robert Loblaw from Canada, Canada writes: Vern McPherson - For a person who hates lies, it seems as you have no compunction about propagating one yourself. The contaminated water problem in Walkerton would have happened regardless of who was in govt. Stan and Frank Koebel who were responsible for analysing and reporting on the condition of the water to the govt. both pleaded guilty to falsifying the reports in Nov. of 2004. Cost cutbacks don't make people lie Vern. Suggesting that the problem was caused by the Harris govt. cost cutting is a convenient way of misleading those who can't be bothered to review the history. Nice try, though, but please don't give anyone a reason to call YOU a liar Vern.

    -----------------------------------------------------------

    blablabla you kow very well the inquiry and the report after the Walkerton tragedy produced a number of recomendations. Who was around to enact them ? Not harris.

    When Mike Harris was run out of town The Ontario Ministry of the Environment had THREE WATER INSPECTORS afor the entire f province ditmush.......Harris fired all the others. How many do we have now blabla and how many deaths ahave we had in Ontario over dirty water since 2003 ?
  63. Vern McPherson from writes: wayne ouellette from Canada writes: What has McGuinty done to help the troubled economy of Ontario. What has he done? He is a liberal and the only way is the liberal way. Buzz, still a liberal supporter? It does not matter what mcguinty sez or does. Ontario is STUCK with this guy for another 3 years. End of story.

    --------------------------------------------------------------

    Another COns mongrel comment. Give weiner 's misfit vote to the lying COns. That's about -------- 8 now ?

    Misfits 8

    Canadians 33.6 million
  64. R. M. from Regina, Canada writes: At least one of these candidates for being a clown in Cirques de Soleil should take the high road...then it would end.
  65. garlick toast from Canada writes: Michael Sharp from Victoria, Canada writes:

    Think Ireland, McGuinty, not Quebec.

    -------------------------------------------------

    thus acknowledging that quebec is a country.
  66. Vern McPherson from writes: Fred Draper from Kingston, Canada writes: We could use a man like Mike Harris (the first term) again. Twice the premier Dalton is. The man had vision, and actively promoted the province in Michigan and other states. We had years with China like GDP growth numbers.

    -----------------------------------------------------------

    AHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHHHAHAHAAH

    Promoted Ontario in Detroit did he freddy ?

    Where are the number s about the business taxes fred ?

    Where are the number s of GDP growth in the Harris years in comparison to China's ?????
  67. Vern McPherson from writes: Nick Wilson from Toronto, Canada writes: As far as I'm concerned, the conservatives can write off Toronto and everybody in Canada would be very happy about that. Toronto Liberals arrogance know no bounds and these rascals need to be taught a good lesson. We need more of Western Canada and less of Ontario and a lot lot less of Toronto in the federal gvmt. Good job Harper, please carry on.

    --------------------------------------------------------

    Another mongrel misfit speaks. The good news is mules can't reproduce.

    Straight out of the COns manual. Write off 40 % of Canada's GDP and 60 % of it's exports and 40 % of Canada's population.

    Govern for our friends only and F the rest ...........

    Add another vote to the misfit column................
  68. Fred Draper from Kingston, Canada writes: Vern McPherson from writes: Small business pay no tax in Ontario ??? Why would anyone opening a business not like that feature ? Did flaherty lie when he said Ontario was the 'last place to invest' ?????

    Vern I hold your abilities to copy/paste in high regard. Your struggles only relate to comprehending your 'work' afterwards, and in trying to slag poor Flaherty at the same time, all the time.

    The Ontario small business tax rate is about 18.62% combined, about 5.5% of that provincial. (1-60%) x 14% = 5.6%, so 'up to 60% less' is true.

    This 5.5% rate is far from the lowest, in fact it's second highest to QC's 8.0% in 2008. MB is 2%, Alberta 3%, NB, NS and NL 5%; BC and SK 4.5%.

    The 'corporate minimum tax' is a tax you pay even if you don't make any money. It is recoverable if/when you do make money. The feds don't have this tax, nor do most (I think) other provinces.

    As your paste suggests, it is applicable only to companies above a certain size.

    so yes, Ontario small businesses DO pay taxes, and sorry to say, Flaherty ain't lying.
  69. Orest Zarowsky from Toronto, Canada writes: Ah yes, Harris. The good old days. Paid for that $200.00 (one-time) tax 'rebate' (see also 'Ralph bucks') by downloading provincial responsibilities onto municipalities. End result being - during his FIRST term - that the amount in taxes and service fees paid by everyone was actually some 15% higher than in the bad old days of the Rae government. And it hasn't improved since. The single biggest legitimate kick against McGuinty is his failure to address the download issue. As for Flaherty and his comments, it is useful to remember that he was considered too extreme even by his own party to win the leadership after Harris retired. It was clear to even the hard-core Harris crew that they would lose the next election if Jimbo was party leader. So we got Eaves instead. And, so far, nothing Flaherty has done, or said, has shown that he has changed. Where Jimbo's 'observations' are especially entertaining is that Harris and Eaves and Flaherty and Ecker were all vehemently opposed to the 'corporate welfare' tax cuts and breaks Flaherty is pushing now. Indeed, one of the reasons that there was so little investment in Ontario industry during the Harris era was his refusal to play that game. This is one of the very few things that Harris did that was a good thing. The next election will be interesting indeed. Not so much in Ontario, where Harper has worked so successfuly to win the hearts and minds of Ontarians. Where even the people in rural areas can grasp the consequences of Harper's not following the 'rep by pop' laws about ridings, all to reduce Ontario's influence. These people may be politically stupid, but they don't like being messed with. And then there's all that crap with the CWB. Amnother core CPC constituancy that Stevo is jerking around - for short-term ideological reasons. Based in a small part of Alberta. Ideologically-driven politics. Ya gotta love the mess they make. And the price to clean it up. Harper is toast.
  70. stan thomas from Canada writes: If today's market is any indication of things to come, the dollar will rise with the price of commodities. This in turn will make Ontario manufacturing more expensive. If also the BoC decides to lower interest rates we may see inflation rear its ugly head. All this combined speaks of more pain to come in southern ontario and quebec. It would be more appropriate for the premiers of these 2 provinces to get together and with the feds devise a plan to lessen the suffering that will surely come. But alas I forgot this is Canada and its more productive here to whine and point fingers at each other than to work together and head this disaster off. We need to act to encourage business and jobs or the social ills will surely follow.
  71. Vern McPherson from writes: Fred Draper from Kingston, Canada writes: 'The Corporate Minimum Tax (CMT) rate is four per cent which is imposed on a corporation's adjusted financial statement income allocated to Ontario. CMT applies to large corporations (or associated groups) with either total revenue in excess of $10 million or total assets in excess of $5 million. Corporations which are liable to CMT are only required to pay CMT to the extent that the CMT exceeds the income tax payable for the taxation year. http://www.rev.gov.on.ca/english/taxes/cmt/ ' For Canadian-controlled private corporations claiming the Incentive Deduction for Small Business (IDSB) Corporations the effective tax rate is 5.5% on the first $400,000 of active business income. Corporations involved in manufacturing and processing, fishing, farming, mining and logging may qualify for a 2% Manufacturing and Processing Profits (M&PP) tax credit. The effective income rate on M&PP income is 12%.' http://www.rev.gov.on.ca/english/taxes/cit/ Hardly out of line freddy. And currently lower than the surrounding States in the US with large manufactitring sectors - none of which I will point out are anywhere close to Ontario's manufacturing sector in $ production and %'age of GDP. Now what is flaherty lying about when he says Ontario should be the last place to invest. That question still remains unanswered by you and all the COns. I know the answer.
  72. Sean L. from Toronto, Canada writes: vern forgot to take his meds again
  73. diane marie from calgary, Canada writes: Just a few points. Public companies don't think long-term, so comments that they should have expected the currency situation to change at some point (decades down the road) don't recognize the reality, which is that most companies are concerned with the quarterly share values. There is no evidence that the sequential 1%-off sales (GST cuts) have had any effect on consumer spending, and even if they did most of the spending is on goods made in China. Can anyone supply any evidence that reductions in corporate taxes have had any effect on spending on productivity-enhancing improvements?

    It seems to me that necessity is the mother of invention. Poorly run companies will fold, no matter how many inducements and supports are showered upon them, mainly because they don't have the effectiveness to take advantage of what is on offer. Many well-run companies don't need any help - that's why they are well-run. Unfortunately, globalism is economic Darwinism. Governments are short-sighted, being concerned only with the next election. Short-sighted voters are equally culpable. If voters, shareholders, and governments are short-sighted, why expect the long view from companies? Houston, we have a problem, and that problem is a mismatch in planning horizons.
  74. Vern McPherson from writes: Referencing ontario, ....

    'Capital tax is a tax levied on a corporation's taxable capital.

    In 2007 Ontario announced a plan to gradually eliminate the capital tax by 2010 as set out in the table below.'

    What ? tax cuts ? In Ontario freddy ? Business tax cuts ? Over a billion of it ?

    What is flaherty lying about freddy ? Why would he have to lie and attack like this to get even if he wasn't so pissed about getting his a$$ kicked in the 2003 election ??
  75. Fred Draper from Kingston, Canada writes: Vern, with the border issues, we need to be much lower than surrounding states. That's where flaherty's 15/10/25 plan comes from.

    Follow the Hazel McCallion approach. Low business taxes and (relatively) high residential taxes. Toronto has taken the opposite approach, and where are they now?

    BTW, I think he said 'Ontario would be the last place', not 'should be'. There's a BIG difference.
  76. Robert Loblaw from Canadathe inquiry and the report after the Walkerton tragedy produced a number of recomendations, Canada writes: Vern McPherson - Your words - 'the inquiry and the report after the Walkerton tragedy produced a number of recomendations' Yes Vern, after the tragedy.

    As I said, this would have happened no matter who was at the helm.

    Again your words - 'how many deaths ahave we had in Ontario over dirty water since 2003 ?'

    How many deaths due to bad water did we have in Ontario before 2003 Vern?

    It had nothing to do with the govt. Vern.

    But is was still a nice try.

    By the way, glad my moniker gives you so much enjoyment. I knew it would appeal to someone other than my children.
  77. Ryan Ginger from ottawa, Canada writes: J Taylor from central Alberta writes, 'McGuinty needs to fix his own house and not blame the Feds...His taxes are what is driving companies to lower tax jurisdiction.'

    J Taylor, the price of oil is at an all time high. When it falls back down to Earth -- and it will -- Ontario will continue to be the engine of Canada, as it has been since the start of the 20th Century. And then Ontario can go on paying for those subsidies and tax breaks given out to oil companies in Alberta, as happened throughout the 1980s and early 1990s.
  78. Fred Draper from Kingston, Canada writes: Vern, there's no love lost between Flaherty and Eves. So I don't think Eves loss in 2003 bothers Flaherty one bit.

    But... Flaherty does have a 'Grond Plon' for Canadian competitiveness. And Dalton hasn't wanted to play ball at all.

    Plus, he's very annoying with his continual carping from the sidelines.
    Dalton likes to blame everyone but hisself. And he's not very courageous at spending his own political capital, just other people's.

    so yes, now its personal.

  79. garlick toast from Canada writes: there are two obvious things to do.using our high dollar and an excellerated asset depreciation allowance,manufacturers should retool to increase efficiency.we should find new markets.india's economy is expanding at 15% per year.they need improved telecommunications and power generation plants.we lead the world in manufactured housing.there must be a market somewhere for what we produce.
  80. Robert Loblaw from Canadathe inquiry and the report after the Walkerton tragedy produced a number of recomendations, Canada writes: garlick toast - There are lots of markets for our manufactured goods and technologies, but it's cheaper for our companies to take the results of their R & D offshore and produce products in the destination countries than it is to pay taxes here.

    Ontario should be rewarding companies exporting made in Canada technologies as long as the manufacturing stays here, but that would take some foresight and planning - something that doesn't happen in McGuinty's govt.
  81. gary marshall from Canada writes: By the way, the taxes that Flaherty refers to as being excessive are the capital investment taxes. Here is a piece of a story from ROB

    ''''' A C.D. Howe study completed in December showed that effective tax rates on capital investment - after planned changes are adopted between now and 2012 - will be by far the highest in Ontario, at 31.2 per cent. By comparison, B.C. will be at 28.6 per cent, Quebec 19.5 per cent and Alberta 18.2 per cent. Those numbers don't take into account changes under B.C.'s recent budget, which will see that province's corporate income tax rate decline from 12 per cent to 11 per cent as of July 1, and to 10 per cent by 2011.'''''''

    Factor in the high sales taxes: Ontario 8%, Alberta 0%, Sask 5%, etc, the higher business and income taxes and you get the picture.

    Keep voting Liberal Ontario and we shall keep accepting more of those skilled Ontarians fleeing the province. We really need the workers. And for those that choose to remain where you are, just have Dalton holler out 'spare change?' every now and then and we shall do our best to help you out.

    Farewell

    Gary Marshall
  82. Concerned Canadian from Canada writes: Fred Draper from Kingston, Canada writes: I never lie Vern, but unlike you, I may make the odd mistake or so.
    Fred Draper from Kingston, Canada writes: We could use a man like Mike Harris (the first term) again.

    Caught you Fred ...
    You just lied ... and made a big odd mistake ...
  83. R L from Canada writes: What a disgrace to see Canada's Minister of Finance telling investors not to invest in Ontario.

    Flaherty in the HoC is openly telling investors that Ontario is the worst place for business in the developed world... is this how a finance minister is supposed to conduct himself?

    It looks like for the sake of Flaherty's own overinflated ego, he would love to see Ontario's economy crash so he can show is ugly grin to the cameras. All Canadians should disapprove of this behaviour, not just Ontarians. I have never observed such blatant insolence from a finance minister.
  84. gary marshall from Canada writes: What a disgrace it is to see the premier of Ontario begging for a Federal handout and blaming the everyone else in the country time and time again for his failed policies.

    Why would anyone ever invest in such a province. And when you bring some advice for the man, he resents it.
  85. The Real PS from Canada writes: Elmo Harris from Niagara, Canada writes: .... I'm going with McGuinty. Sound fiscal management. Mature leadership.

    Oh good God, its not surprising the province is in a mess with people like Elmo allowed to vote....
  86. Vern McPherson from writes: flaherty just lied again about Ontatio's debt on CBC politics.

    What he failed to mention with all the GDP growth fred draper fantcises about the Provinvial debt went form 90 Billion in 95, to 140 billion in 03. Freddy if Ontario was doing so well under Harris why was he borrowing so much money between 95 and 03 ?

    He said as a result of Bob Rae Ontario was paying something like a million a minute in 95. Well the interest on 90 billion is a lot less than the interest on 140 biillion whichis what all those splendid years the harrisCOns were in office LOL !!!

    Interest on the debt 80 million Ontario debt in 1995 = 7.832 billion

    Interest on the 140 billion Ontario debt in 2003 = 9.604 billion.

    That's what 23 % more than when Rae was the Premier ?

    How much has the debt increased under McGuinty you ask ??

    Go here and see for yourself:

    http://www.ofina.on.ca/debt/borrowhistory.htm#debthistory
  87. The Real PS from Canada writes: But RL, Flaherty's right, perhaps not politically correct but right. And by the way McGuinty started this childing display with his comments on the budget
  88. Always Right from Canada writes:
    Tickle me Elmo. Didn't know they allowed computer access at Linhaven. Are you on day pass?
  89. Always Right from Canada writes:

    Hey Wilkie. They could have been 'reminded' today but only seven Liberals showed. Strong reminder.
  90. gary marshall from Canada writes: I would like to thank the Federal Liberal Party for not voting against the Conservative budget. Obviously they thought what it contained good for the country. They had their ch