Skip navigation

 Login or Register | Member Centre

The perils of legislating a healthy aesthetic

SIRI AGRELL

From Saturday's Globe and Mail

Latest comment posted at 2:17 PM EDT 24/04/08

Can state solutions eliminate a scourge that stalks women everywhere? ...Read the full article

This conversation is closed

  1. Jennifer Rollison from Canada writes: So, jeanne beker believes "eagerness to blame fashion for eating disorders is a cultural witch hunt akin to demonizing gangster rap or violent video games". What world is she living in where the fashion industry lionizes girls who are below a size zero? whatever zero means. Young women are dying ie: the two Uraguayan sisters. When does it become real for the fashion business? What does ms. beker need to convince her the 'fashion' industry does emulate the vision of eating disorders, there is no other way to be that skinny (as in Kate Moss doing heroine {ie: heroin chic} to stay skinny enough to remain a model). She should be ashamed of herself as should any company using such freakishly skinny 'models'.
  2. JD Wood from Toronto, Canada writes: Of course the state needs to legislate a healthy aesthetic if it will protect the population. The objectivists, of course, will go on about how it has no such business doing so. But what is the point of the state legislating anything else? The state needs to create a cradle for the people to act as a healthy launch point for happiness.
  3. lotusland maritimer from Sault Ste Marie, Canada writes: Very simply the gangsters who run these girls must be charged with murder or manslaughter that will put a stop to it. Near the town where I live lived a very beautiful young girl indeed who became a major model. As I had met her and seen her possibly danced with her at a wedding I knew what she looked like and simply she was as near to perfection as possible. I was absolutely horrified when I saw a year later a fashion spread in a major magazine, she has become an ugly anorexic freak very far from the picture of youthful beauty vigour and health that she radiated a year previously. These people are sick, abusers of children, white slavedrivers and degenerate perverts. And last but not least aesthetic imbeciles. While there are different standards of beauty only a very perverted sense of attractiveness and pathological control freaks would tell a perfect young female beauty that she is fat and needs to lose thirty pounds. My guess she weighed a healthy 130 lbs before these sickos got hold of her and as a model weighed a sickly and dangerous 90 lbs. There isnt the slightest question in my mind that her handlers were responsible for her pathological ugly transformation. These thugs need to go behind bars at the minimum. Those girls who died were simply murdered by their owners handlers coaches. These are a bunch of very very sick and inhuman monsters. All decent people boycott such outrageous abusers. And governments act. Where are the feminists?
  4. gordon davies from Victoria B.C., Canada writes: Curiosity caused the barf , as those that see these subjugated souls as beauty , sure has a demented view of the world around them . I guess the female sex have their freaks as the male sex have these musclebound freaks of their own.
  5. M Hawk from Canada writes: Be careful of using BMI to test girls. My BMI is 16 or 18 as i recall, but it's because i'm pretty naturally lean, and also tall. Height messes up the use of the BMI scale, and models are all required to be at least 5'7.
    According to my BMI, i'm supposed to drop dead pretty soon from malnutrition, when it's just not the case. (i'm also a runner)

    But i'm all for regulating the size of models. My spouse used to be in the industry and he left because of the rampant drug use and awful environment that encouraged girls to waste away.
  6. W M from Canada writes: “These images are not to be taken literally,” she said. “At every photo shoot there are 50 people scurrying around trying to get that girl to look like that. It's a fairy tale.”

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    You know, that argument might hold some water, were the objective behind the "fairy tale" NOT to attract customers and encourage them to throw down their money for a piece of the "fairy tale". But, since that is the entire business rationale behind creating those "fairy tales" and since people do plop down 10s of billions of dollars per year pursuing that "fairy tale", Jeanne Becker is either decieving herself or trying to decieve us.
  7. NORTH MAN from Canada writes: just a way to make fat people feel good

    the only way a leftist knows how to solve a problem is ban it

    so fat is healthy but skinny is not

    i think we should also make photos of obesse people illegal
    put that way it now sounds stupid doesnt it
  8. Jennifer Rollison from Canada writes: North, a skeletal person is not healthy no matter what. This does not have to be about fat or skinny. People are dying from anorexia and the fashion industry emulates skeletal women. Get real...
  9. M E from Canada writes: If the day ever comes when obesity is considered beautiful and girls are encouraged to gain 100 pounds to become models, then it would make sense to consider banning pictures of seriously overweight people in fashion magazines.
  10. Lil Kross from Calgary, Canada writes: It is sad that models are taught to lose so much weight so that they can become top models. The industry is awful that way. It is there job to promote beauty and girls and women bury that deep in their minds. They measure themselves against that ideal beauty every day and do whatever it takes to look that way. I think that it is very sad. Healthy women are beutiful and I think the idea behind the law is to prevent the fasion and advertising industry to stop promoting anorexia as sexy and ideal.

    It was not fashionable or beautiful in the concentration camps why should it be now?
  11. Doris Wrench Eisler from St. Albert. AB, Canada writes: Legislation may or may not solve this problem, but it's worth a try. The argument that it may criminalize the sick and send them over the edge seems circular; why did they become sick in the first place? The fashion industry, along with other institutions, has a great deal of influence over women, who are taught to please others, be attractive and "fit in". So the question of "free will" seems moot to begin with. Painfully thin models send a powerful and dangerous message and the fashion, cosmetics and other industries involved with role modelling for women should be curtailed by legislation.
    It's high time.
  12. Puzzled One from Canada writes: As a healthy 5'9 woman with a BMI of 18, I agree with M E in the cautious use of BMI.

    Rather than outright the outright banning of uber-thin models from runways, legislation should perhaps be more inclusive of body types-- a certain percent of models need to have a BMI of 20-25, another percent 25-30 etc. to reflect the diversity of the human body.

    And to Ms. Beker's self-serving ignorance that modeling thinness does not beget a desire for thinness-- yes, actually, playing video games has been correlated to an increase in violent behaviour. Fashion models and advertising supposedly reflect society's ideal to the consumer-- when that ideal is unattainable (either beauty or body type) the consumer in turn sees herself as lacking. Not a good message for anyone to receive, let alone young girls.
  13. w and from Canada writes: Shouldn't we be using the only true measures for longivity such as cholesterol level or HDL/LDL readings to determine healthly vs unhealthy? ie. heathly looking people may not necessarily live longer nor cost society less in health care.
  14. J Brocha from Toronto, Canada writes: I modeled briefly when I began high school (10ish years ago), and at 120 lbs and 5 '10 I was told to loose weight. They were "polite" about it, suggesting I do crunches and join a gym. I was 14 years old, and only ate dinner -- not breakfast or lunch. I had already started to develop an eating disorder.
    When I told my mom about their request, she promptly pulled me from modeling, and I greatly appreciate that she did. I am a healthy weight now, but there's no way I would ever be asked to model by the industry.
    I saw Jeanne Beker in a restaurant once, and she WASN'T EATING. She just had a glass of red wine.
    Take from that what you will...
  15. Andrew E from Canada writes: how about a skinny girl registry? "if it saves one life...."
  16. Stacey Mercer from St. John's, Canada writes: I once read the optimal look for clothes in a fashion show was to have it look like the fashions are displayed on a hanger. Instead of having women staving themselves for their high paying glamorous careers, why not just place the fashions on hangers for display on the runway.
    If people were dying in less glamorous occupations, like they are in the fashion industry, the public would be outraged and would force the industry to do something to prevent this carnage. As a society we are too easily lead to buy into the fairy tale of looking a certain way, driving this type of car, and wearing these clothes will make you whole. There is no east fix. We share the burden of guilt with the fashion industry. Just like those unfortunate models our sense of whats real and attractive is warped.
  17. Green Gene from Federal Bluesville, Canada writes: A friend, who had the inclination to spend time on Vancouver's seedier side, informed me once that certain drug addicts had cravings for a chocolate covered marshmallow confection that we shall call piva vuffs. Methinks that if some of the posters on here are correct, the makers of said piva vuffs should be able to target their marketing to those addicts, maybe showing images of them using their drug of addiction and enjoying their piva vuffs afterward. But no, you say that's wrong, it's illegal, and these people are being used to peddle a product and aesthetic that is not in any way healthy. So I say to those who believe that the French government is trying to dictate aesthetic values, and to those who say that those carrying a few extra pounds may be the next to be placed on a ban: we have a responsibility to limit the influence of unhealthy practices on our young and the images being touted as desirable depict a lifestyle a lot more unhealthy than a "few extra pounds". Exploiting ill people is one thing, contributing to the illness is nefarious: shame on you Jeanne, my daughter might be exposed to your old days on the new music magazine...but we're gonna steer clear of your "fashion" journalism!
  18. Jennifer Rollison from Canada writes: Stacey, for a management course I am taking for my bachelor's degree we are reading a book on 'branding'. I am horrified by the psychology behind branding ie: branding makes us feel happy, the brand is my friend, it makes others jealous of me, I am in a certain 'class' by driving my mercedes. We are inundated with images and messages telling us how to live and what to look like. Girls as young as two are on diets because of the images they see. Yet we continue to emulate anorexic models...other than being 'clothes hangers' what do these people contribute to society? The fashion industry standards are appalling. I would also urge all nay-sayers to go and google some 'pro-ana) sites and read what young women (mostly) are saying to one another about anorexia. Wake up...size zero means you are nothing...
  19. Jennifer Rollison from Canada writes: By the way, google "Isabelle Caro" and go to images to see a 66 pound 'model'...up from 55 pounds...the images are atrocious.
  20. Sarah Bee from Canada writes: Marilyn Monroe was one of the sexiest stars of all time. When they auctioned off her clothing several years ago, her wardrobe ranged from a size 8 to a size 14.

    She was gorgeous, voluptuous and a total beauty and sex icon.

    So to you disgusting designers and producers who feel that real beauty doesn't cut it for "luxury brands"... Shove that up your butts.
  21. C L from Canada writes: I used to put up with the irritating Ms Beker in order to see the fashion but I stopped watching a long time ago when Prada started the current emaciated trend. I have more fun looking at Couturier patterns on EBay. Ms Beker recently lost weight - probably to fit into the fashion samples but she does not look better than she did before. While it is true that fashion promotes fantasy there is nothing wrong with a healthy fantasy such as size 8 - 10. If you look at Deborah Kerr in the 1957 "King and I" versus the thinner Jodie Foster in the 1999 "Anna and the King" - who looks better in the dresses? Audrey Hepburn was held up as an icon but her small frame was partly due to starvation in Holland during the war. I agree with legislation because fashion is a business. MBA types seem to need regulation - there is no industry (including journalism) that they have not made worse; maybe they should be trained differently.
  22. G Young from Jeanne Beker seserves a smack up-side the head, Canada writes: The idea of legislation may be a good one, but Consumers! Start voting with your wallet immediately! Do not, and even more importantly NEVER let your children: buy fasion magazines or celebrity rags; watch fashion television, music videos or e-magazine shows; hang out at malls. It is flat-out ridiculous that we have allowed this industry to make the money it does playing fast and loose with people's lives and sense of security.
  23. Jennifer Rollison from Canada writes: G. Young...I agree about talking with your wallet. I try to always be conscious of where my money is going...I once asked my family, for my birthday, to NOT shop at walmart for a whole year. I got my wish and now none of my family shops there at all.
  24. Puzzled One from Canada writes: Actually, Audrey Hepburn was anorexic.
  25. SN Dream from Canada writes: When dealing with issue like this, it's better to relay on better parenting and treatment instead of legislation and prohibition.

    Also, the society as a whole need to stop criticizing how people dress.
  26. Life Insurance Bribe from Canada writes: Anorexia/bulemia & the promotion of it is terrible. Unfortunately, a far worse problem for society is the growing (literally) obesity epidemic. Even people who think of themselves as 'fit' or even just 'average' are often terribly out of shape & risking early death (to say nothing of the billions in extra health costs taxpayers must pay).

    BMI isn't a good measure, by the way... I'm a male with about 18% bodyfat but who lifts weights & is muscular, & so is technically (according to BMI) 'overweight'.

    [I'm a huge supporter of gay rights & equality etc., but I've wondered whether there is a correlation between the number of gay men who are designers or otherwise involved in the fashion industry, & the way in which too-skinny women resemble pre-pubescent boys rather than women with curves. (I'm sure someone will attack me for this sentiment...) Just wondering.]
  27. Cooler Head from West of TO, Canada writes: Interesting article.

    I was in the gym on Saturday. Both ends of the spectrum were there. A young woman whose quads I could have circled with my thumbs and forefingers, and a guy with such a massive upper body that he couldn’t put his arms down to his sides. His biceps were as large as her waist.

    Both were working out at a feverish pitch to achieve some personally distorted body image – their conception of perfection.

    By the way, isn’t is sad seeing the people who could do something about the fashion industry – Beker and Robin Kay – acting as apologists for this deeply troubled industry.
  28. Kim Philby from Ottawa, Canada writes: My understanding of anorexia is that it is a mental disorder. That being the case, do the fashion industry and pro-thin websites induce this illness, or do they only serve to promote the idea that the illness is okay? In any case, even if they do not actually induce the illness, they shouldn't be allowed to promote anorexia as something positive. Imagine a website urging depressed people to commit suicide. Would we tolerate that?

    Having said that, I wonder how much of an influence the fashion world really has. Since we seem to be in the midst of an obesity epidemic, rather than an anorexia epidemic, the industry seems to be influencing only those who have the mental illness of anorexia.
  29. D F from Canada writes: I try to lead by example and I teach my children that magazines and fashion are little more than fantasy really, something to not to base our life or reality on. The thing we need to be aware of is that if we do healthy things like staying active physically and mentally, we do things we enjoy and we put healthy things in our bodies the majority of the time. Then we will look and feel our true best - regardless of what the preferences of society happen to be at that time. I emphasize that we all feel pressured at times to be or look different and sometimes we just want to be different. However, if we keep our guidelines in mind, for the most part we feel good and balanced and are healthy.
  30. Sue City from Canada writes: Promoting extreme thinness encourages women to kill themselves - period. Do we encourage gun owners to point at their head and pull the trigger?

    Jeanne Beker is a fool for fashion. Actually, I find the entire fashion industry vapid and irrelevant.
  31. Apples Oranges from United States writes: This is a nanny state manufactured issue all mixed up in all that political correction goodness.

    The fact of the matter is that while eating dissorders affecting young women to be thin is a problem to be addressed, the other eating disorder that affects over 60% of ALL women is far deadlier and worrisome: being fat. Why should do we need to say "fat is beautiful" or have fat acceptance societies? Being fat should not be accepted by society.What kind of message are we sending to people that being 50 pounds overweight is just dandy and that you look beautiful anyway if you are?

    More nonsense...obesity IS the real problem, not a few models who starve themselves with coke and cigarettes and a few others puking after lunch. Instead of obsessing over skinny girls (which stinks of societal envy) how about we as a society start obsessing over the REAL killer: fat women and men.
  32. Erin Pratt from Hamilton, Canada writes: I wish people would stop blaming the fashion industry and magazines for eating disorders and focus on the fact that they are a mental illness. I come from a family of women who suffer from Bi-polar disorder and other mood disorders and one of the common things that happens to them in adolescence is an obsession with body image and eating. Often Anorexia and Bulimia are precursors to other mental disorders or symtoms of larger issues. Not all girls or women who read fashion magazines or model have eating disorders, and the ones who do are usually wrestling with more than just their waist size.
  33. S Kimmel from Toronto, Canada writes: Heaven forbid the fashion industry should design clothes for actual female figures instead of those of young boys, which forces models to be ultra slim.
  34. Jennifer Rollison from Canada writes: Interesting reading the apologists for the fashion biz. While bulimics and anorexics are not, generally, runway models, the business exhorts young women to be as tiny as possible to wear the clothes they 'design'. The outcome: normal healthy young women becoming anorexic to fit an image of women impossible to attain. Yes, I get the point regarding the mental disorder. However, urging women to lose weight and become skeletal to 'fit' into clothes is abuse...as is drug use for meeting the same end.

    Life Insurance, I have read books dealing with what you are talking about ie: the prepubescent, boyish 'look' of models. Try reading 'Backlash' by Susan Faludi...an excellent expose on how women are treated in the media.
  35. El Christador from Vancouver, Canada writes: I think governments should legislate all aspects of people's thoughts and aspirations in a way that will make the world a better place. This is clearly a good idea.

    There are many TV shows and other cultural things, for instance, that glorify wealth, professional success, and status, as the ways to find fulfillment in life. This is clearly shallow and wrong and immature, and just as bad as basing your self-esteem on an ideal of beauty (actually, it probably causes more harm, since stress, overwork, compulsive workaholicism, and depression cause a lot more health problems in our society than eating disorders, and such value systems facilitate such problems).

    So, for example, anyone expressing admiration at an expensive car or a nice house, or encouraging their children to pursue a certain career because it would make them a "winner" in society's eyes should be sent to jail.

    This is what government is for: to make you who you ought to be, and to make you live your life in The One Correct Way, and clearly only the government can know what that One Correct Way is.
  36. El Christador from Vancouver, Canada writes: Heaven forbid the fashion industry should design clothes for actual female figures instead of those of young boys, which forces models to be ultra slim.

    Haute couture isn't about clothes that people will actually wear any more than modern art is intended to be about producing paintings or sculptures that regular people would want in their homes. So, they could produce clothes for realistic female figures, but why? What would that have to do with their aims. The point of the model is to be something to display the clothes on so people can see the clothes. A mannequin. Is it the fashion industry's fault if people decide to take fashion models as an ideal of female beauty? Did the fashion industry ever intend that?
  37. Robin Smythe from Toronto, Canada writes: Most women who look at skinny fashion models do not become anorexic... Anorexia is a mental disorder. Fashion images may contribute to an already-existing mental issue, but there is no direct cause-and-effect relationship between viewing these images and starving oneself.

    The idea that a certain type of art should be illegal just because it may have unintentional emotional effects on people who are mentally unstable to begin with is scary. ANYTHING could eventually fall under that category.
  38. B L from Canada writes: El Christador from Vancouver, Canada writes: I think governments should legislate all aspects of people's thoughts and aspirations in a way that will make the world a better place. This is clearly a good idea.

    Sarcasm noted. Duh. We're not talking "aspirations", we're talking actions.

    I LIKE couture. I think (some of it) is a beautiful and interesting artistic expression. HOWEVER - in most other industries, when there is a pattern of health issues that are a direct result of their participation in that industry, it gets regulated. If the industry won't self-regulate to maintain the health of it's models, then the government SHOULD step in. They aren't just clothes hangers, they are PEOPLE.

    Having said that.... the fashion spreads in most magazines are NOT couture, they are selling some brand of fashion to sell to consumers.

    And since another poster already mentioned the principles of branding, here's another one: People buy more crap when they feel bad about themselves.
  39. Dick Nails from Canada writes: Finally. The government MUST dictate a) what we eat, b) how much c) what we shall weigh (BMI RULES!!) and of course d) think. And oh yeah, e) think.

    Nice to see that liberal fascism is gaining more adherents who dress up their societal concerns as 'we know what is good for you dear, do as we say' rather than plain ol' statism.

    See you all at the rally tonight. Remember, boys black shirts and pants and girls, brown shirts and skirts. And don't forget the torch ligth rally after.
  40. C L from Canada writes: John Galliano has sent models of all shapes and sizes dressed in couture down the runway proving that he is a master tailor and a true artist.
  41. doctor business from vancouver, Canada writes: Fashion is a business. That's all. It is the business of preying on and exploiting body image insecurities. Like Gambling or Cockfighting - we have to consider is this an industry that does more harm than good in society as a whole. I don't think that we should legislate to change this industry. I think we should legislate to ban it.

    While crybaby millionaires of the fashion industry may claim that their rights are being abridged and a less draconian solution is more productive: they cannot deny that this is the same problem we've had for decades and the problem is only getting worse. To expect the fashion industry to do what is responsible is to expect the impossible. We should know better.

    Some may say it is logistically impossible to do this. I say: try. These are legally registered corporations that have bank accounts we can trace. To drive it underground in this case would be better. Unlike drugs, I don't think illegal fashion is going to be worse. It will be more diverse. If people want skinny porn they can sell it as skinny porn and have severe restrictions as the rest of porn has.
  42. Arn N from Kitchener, Canada writes: Yes, I agree that skeletal women are disgustingly gross...

    ...BUT...

    many, many, MANY more women die from obesity related deseases than anorexia. Clearly, skinny images are NOT influencing the vast majority of women!!

    If we ban skinny people then we have to ban over-weight people from the media too!
  43. whatevah D from Canada writes: J Brocha from Toronto, Canada writes: I modeled briefly when I began high school (10ish years ago), and at 120 lbs and 5 '10 I was told to loose weight. They were "polite" about it, suggesting I do crunches and join a gym. I was 14 years old, and only ate dinner -- not breakfast or lunch. I had already started to develop an eating disorder.
    When I told my mom about their request, she promptly pulled me from modeling, and I greatly appreciate that she did. I am a healthy weight now, but there's no way I would ever be asked to model by the industry.
    I saw Jeanne Beker in a restaurant once, and she WASN'T EATING. She just had a glass of red wine.
    Take from that what you will...

    Interesting about Beker... she has daughters of her own doesn't she? what kind of example is she setting?

    I think you're mom on the other hand did the right thing; she sounds great. My friend modeled in high school and she would have half a cup of rice and a diet pepsi for dinner.

Comments are closed

Thanks for your interest in commenting on this article, however we are no longer accepting submissions. If you would like, you may send a letter to the editor.

Report an abusive comment to our editorial staff

close

Alert us about this comment

Please let us know if this reader’s comment breaks the editor's rules and is obscene, abusive, threatening, unlawful, harassing, defamatory, profane or racially offensive by selecting the appropriate option to describe the problem.

Do not use this to complain about comments that don’t break the rules, for example those comments that you disagree with or contain spelling errors or multiple postings.

Top Health Stories

Top Stories by Section