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My chemical romance

HAYLEY MICK

From Friday's Globe and Mail

Latest comment posted at 1:30 PM EDT 25/04/08

As Ontario prepares to go pesticide-free, gardening diehards are fighting a ban they say puts their perfect lawns in jeopardy. But it'll take more than a bylaw to stop the most resourceful from keeping their grass greener ...Read the full article

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  1. PANIC! At The Ice Floe from Ottawa, Canada writes: I really think people are going to start experiencing ban fatigue. People will soon come to realize that bans actually need enforcement, and with so many bans coming into effect (and many more on the horizon), people will soon start ignoring them.

    I mean seriously...Do we really need people to use clear garbage bags to ensure they aren't throwing out potentially recyclable material? What have we come to?

    Can anyone tell me why it is that Liberal and NDP are the first to demand restrictions of rights, yet the Conservatives are the least likely to impose one??? Shouldn't it be the other way around? Just thinking of the party names, you'd swear it would be the opposite!

    Let me guess...Partisans will start jumping up and down saying that Cons don't care about anyone, blah blah blah.
  2. ken g from Canadian in Mexico City, Canada writes: I have no idea how the Provincial government expects to police all these bans - create more departments with inspectors?

    The Provincial government seems to be focused on minuscule things, but with small minds what should you expect.
  3. P Conner from toronto, Canada writes: Bragging about continuing use of poison? I wonder how his neighbours feel about living near such a person. Especially those with children and dogs?
  4. City Pig from Toronto, Canada writes: I remember a few years back the City of Toronto banned the use of pesticides under a new by law. I find it interesting when I take my walks in High Park and see warning signs on the lawns cautioning due to pesticide use. Appearantly the city can't control weeds or pests organically but they expect everyone else to.
  5. M Clarke from Canada writes: I don't understand people's fetish for perfectly manicured lawns. Why do people need gardens that look like golf greens? My guess - because the Joneses next door have one.
  6. Knowledge is True Opinion from Canada writes: M Clarke, I completely agree. People have a tendecy to have a knee jerk reaction to bans. But let's look at the big picture IT'S a LAWN!! Potential health risks and environmental issues are not trumped by your 'right' to have a perfect lawn. If you don't like it dig it up and throw down wood chips and stop wasting all that water.

  7. The Oracle from Caiman Islands, Canada writes: They can get pesticide but be branded lunatics, fanatics.
  8. The comment section stinks from Canada writes: Count me as one who will be stock piling herbicides each spring. One trip to Buffalo each year is all I need to do. You EnviroNazi's can try to rat me out for having an attractive lawn all you want - unless Captain Government gets a warrant to raid my garage for evidence, I'll just claim it's accomplished with organics (which suck by the way). Prove otherwise.

    Keep off my grass if you're so freaked out about cancer.
  9. Mark Hathaway from Toronto, Canada writes: Contrary to the beliefs of some, it is perfectly possible - and even quite simple - to maintain a green and healthy lawn without the use of pesticides. First off, avoid the use of chemical fertilizers which make your lawn more vulnerable to insect infestations. Secondly, in the spring, aerate your soil, spead some composted manure (or something similar) on the grass, and overseed. Avoid Kentucky bluegrass and opt instead for some fescue varieties. As well, add Dutch white clover to your lawn - it fixes nitrogen, helps prevent grubs, and resists drought. It also is wonderful to walk on and adds a deep green tone to your lawn. If a few dandelions appear in your lawn, just pull them up and add some clover seed where you uproot them. (Dandelions are often the sign of poor soil quality, something the clover will help remedy...) Water your lawn thoroughly once a week if there has been no rain and don't cut the grass too short. I have maintained my lawn in this way for over six years, and normally have one the greenest and most drought-resistant lawns in my neighbourhood.
  10. PANIC! At The Ice Floe from Ottawa, Canada writes: Knowledge is True Opinion: Ah yes, but the TRUE question is what about property rights? I do agree that 'it's just a lawn', however, where does it end? Does it end here, or is there another ban right around the corner that further infringes on property rights?

    I want to state clearly as possible. I don't use the stuff. However, I believe that education, and not a ban is the way to handle this situation. You can't tell me that education awareness hasn't worked. In my neighbourhood alone, I can safely estimate a reduction in pesticide use of around 80%, and that's being conservative. All that without the expense of an outright ban.
  11. PANIC! At The Ice Floe from Ottawa, Canada writes: The comment section stinks : I have no idea how they will enforce this ban, but if it's like the west island of montreal, they will do soil samples of your lawn.
  12. Robert Rivers from France writes: Change the name of this article... there is very popular band who already has this re-estate...
  13. Logo Pogo from United States writes: 'PANIC! At The Ice Floe from Ottawa, Canada writes: Knowledge is True Opinion: Ah yes, but the TRUE question is what about property rights? I do agree that 'it's just a lawn', however, where does it end? Does it end here, or is there another ban right around the corner that further infringes on property rights?'

    'Property Rights' were oddly left out of the Charter of Rights. In the past a few politicians have tried to get 'Property Rights' included in the Charter but for some reasons politicians never seem interested in carrying it through.

    It's a same really and would stop many of the nonsense, nanny state laws that provinces have been passing of late.
  14. More or Less from Canada writes: If these chemicals are so bad they must be banned for use by homeowners, then they should be banned for use everywhere. This is just politics and not concern about health. Is Health Canada a bunch of dumb bunnies and the Ontario government knows all?
  15. bethany middleton from Vancouver, Canada writes: PANIC - the conservatives are very good at restricting rights - look at their stance on abortion, women's 'equality' (which has now been scrubbed out of any text concerning the participation of women in the public sphere, police and privacy issues, same sex marriage....and you could even argue that the conservatives' lack of leadership on climate issues and environmental issues is also restrictive, in that it restricts the rights of all Canadians for a healthy environment free of toxic and dangerous contaminants.

    so your lawn won't look 'perfect'. Perhaps we need to redefine what perfection actually is - wouldn't a natural lawn actually be more 'perfect' than an artifice created from toxic chemicals. Reminds of makeup in the eighteenth century - for both men and women - that was made of arsenic. It doesn't matter how beautiful you are; you'll still die.
  16. The comment section stinks from Canada writes: PANIC! At The Ice Floe from Ottawa, Canada writes: The comment section stinks : I have no idea how they will enforce this ban, but if it's like the west island of montreal, they will do soil samples of your lawn.
    ---------------------

    Wow. I don't know if I should laugh or cry at how easily we are allowing our freedoms to be erroded by the enviornmental movement. “This is how Liberty dies—with thunderous applause.”
  17. Knowledge is True Opinion from Canada writes: Unfortunately PANIC, education just doesn't seem to work. People either choose to be ignorant or just don'y pay attention. Look at smoking and it's effects, yet people conitnue to start.

    Also consider exhibit A: 'This Comment Section Stinks'
    Education is the better way and I wish things could be done that way.

    As for 'rights' and your property, 'where doe it end' There are already a lot of things you can't do on your propery. You can't burn tires on yoru lawn, but damn it, it's my propery and I have the right to do what I want.
  18. Badges? We don't need no stinking badges from Canada writes: MMMmmmm....I love the smell of 'KILLEX (TM)' in the morning
  19. Luna Nova from Canada writes: Total confession - I put up a 'warning - pesticide use' sign on my lawn. I don't use them, but it sure keeps the neighbours dogs and kids away! Tee-hee!
  20. PANIC! At The Ice Floe from Ottawa, Canada writes: Ok knowledge...As for burning stuff...When does the ban on charcoal bbq's kick in then? How about backyard fireplaces? Nobody needs a charcoal bbq (even though people like the taste more) and nobody needs the ambiance of an outdoor fireplace on a nice summer evening, right?
  21. PANIC! At The Ice Floe from Ottawa, Canada writes: Daniel, it would be impossible to legally pursue someone like you are proposing. The products are legal in Canada.

    As for pools...I say chlorinated pools are soon a thing of the past. That ban should be soon...after the scent ban of course!
  22. Knowledge is True Opinion from Canada writes: Panic, you are off on a different topic and clearly missed the point.

    You do not and never had the right to do whatever you want on your property. To your other point, education is the better way but unfortunately human nature dictates that you need to ban things or people refuse to change their behaviour. Sad but true.

    Burning tires is illegal, burning charcoal isn't. If burning charcoal is found to leach into the ground water and possibly make people and animals sick then that trumps my 'want' (not right) to sit around the charcoal.
  23. daniel coates from Almonte, Ontario, Canada writes: I promise no further comment, but to my neighbour 'Ice Floe': if you think the 'legal' sale of a product somehow protects the vendor from liability, think of the 'legal' sale of tobacco products and the massive financial settlements the manufacturers have had to pay -- some of the very successful suits actually brought by governments at the state and provincial level.
  24. Peter S from Toronto, Canada writes: What really needs to change is the bourgeois attitude that a perfect green lawn is a necessity or a right. It's just freakin grass - let it grow, pull some weeds by hand if they offend you, but stop polluting the ground and the run off water with these chemicals. We don't live on Wisteria Lane - this is reality, and it's time we face up to our own attitudes about frivolous pursuits that are damaging the earth.
  25. carol c from Canada writes: People are obsessed with lawns. Lawns were introduced by the British nobility as a sign of wealth. They didn't need to grow food and could hire labourers to look after the lawn so it was green, lush and beautiful. We immitate this on our smaller properties, but the reasoning seems pretty much the same. I've ripped up most of the lawn in my postage stamp garden and grow plants instead.
  26. Golden Crumb from Canada writes: banning pesticides is an issue of freedom?

    give me a break!

    police brutality with regards to the issue of overuse of tasers is an issue of freedom.

    the fact that Harper has grossly limited media access to parliament is an issue of freedom.

    not being able to travel in continental North America without a passport is an issue of freedom.

    Keep things in perspective people.
  27. Neocon Destroyer from Anywhere But Alberta, Canada writes: Hard choice! A green lawn or my family getting cancer. Hmmm, have to think about that for a while. On the other hand, I do like to see dead fish floating to the top of the lake that gets the runoff from my green lawn. I'm torn. I think I'll go with the green lawn. It's so perdy.
  28. Paul Thompson from Canada writes: Good point Golden Crumb.
  29. stand up mimi from Canada writes: I propose another ban: A ban on the term 'nanny state', which keeps reappearing most tiresomely in the comment section after every news item.
  30. Dick Nails from Canada writes: M Clarke from Canada writes: I don't understand people's fetish for perfectly manicured lawns. Why do people need gardens that look like golf greens? My guess - because the Joneses next door have one.

    >> No, it is the Clarke's next door. Finally we can be rid of the hegemony of lawns. The ON govt's next logical step is to ban lawns and gardens unless they are all, individually, precisely and with the finest of a detailed inspection by a new department in charge of inspections (and of course, huge gigantic fines and jail time), cleared for using only organics purchased from govt funded and operated organic garden supply stores. It is simple: either go organic or get your lawn and garden nuked by the ON govt. Anyone who disagrees with this must take it up with Dalton.
  31. PANIC! At The Ice Floe from Ottawa, Canada writes: Well, Knowledge, as I said before, education worked for me and a strong majority of my neighbourhood. As for the examples of burning tires being illegal and charcoal legal, remember that pesticides are a legal product. So, if the Gov't wants to impose its will on people using a legal product (pesticides), what is to stop them with other legal products (e.g. charcoal)? Are pesticides probably bad? Sure. There's lots of groups who say they are, and on the surface, they might very well be right. I just really have an issue with bans (and no, I don't believe a ban is warranted, education is). I really do think it's a very slippery slope when you start telling people what they can and cannot do in and around their house. I guess it's called the Charter of Rights and Freedoms for a reason...It amazes me how quick people are to give them up over something that remains a legal product and one which Health Canada says is safe. Have they ever said exactly how this will be enforced anyways? Soil samples? Snitch lines? I guess it's kind of like how neo-cons see the patriot act, only in reverse. They say it's no big deal taking away rights for the common good...You say it's no big deal taking away rights and freedoms for the common good. Personally, I like my rights and freedoms, so I hate them both. Anyways, I'm off to play some Golf...Oops, bad word these days eh? All the best!
  32. Knowledge is True Opinion from Canada writes: Stand up mini, agreed, however, I'd like to also include any 1984 references and 'path to communism' references.
  33. Howard Roark from Whitby, Canada writes: Golden Crumb:
    I don't think your examples of 'freedom' are good.

    Tasers are not 'overused' just 'overreported'. Harper has the same amount of press restrictions/controls that Chretien had. And the US and Mexico are independant nations with the right to change entry rules at their discretion (we never had a 'right' to travel unhindered in NA).

    Don't use stupid examples to take cheap shots at those you clearly disagree with. I agree that this ban straddles the line between personal choice, and what is good for society overall, but it is the same for all restrictions and rules.
  34. Howard Roark from Whitby, Canada writes: Neocon Destroyer from Anywhere But Alberta, Canada writes: Hard choice! A green lawn or my family getting cancer. Hmmm, have to think about that for a while. On the other hand, I do like to see dead fish floating to the top of the lake that gets the runoff from my green lawn. I'm torn. I think I'll go with the green lawn. It's so perdy.

    >> Could you be more sensationalist? You sound like Al Gore. Dead fish and dying families...

    I agree that there is an increase risk of cancers with many of these products (which is why I prefer not to use them), but writing this is foolish and alarmist.
  35. Knowledge is True Opinion from Canada writes: Get a grip people.
    This isn't a freedom or rights issue. As Golden Crumb tried to put into perspective.

    YOU DO NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO DO WHATEVER YOU WANT ON YOUR PROPERTY. YOU NEVER HAVE.

    When what you do on your property can adversly affect someone else, expecially something that is trivial and cosmetic then you can be told to stop.

    I get people's issue with bans. But this isn't a slipery slope issue. If people can't directly equate what they are doing to health or environmental issue then they wont change their behaviour. Unfortunately bans are needed because people are self centered, lazy and ignorant. AGAIN, sad but unfortunatily the reality.




  36. Howard Roark from Whitby, Canada writes: bethany middleton from Vancouver, Canada writes: PANIC - the conservatives are very good at restricting rights - look at their stance on abortion, women's 'equality' (which has now been scrubbed out of any text concerning the participation of women in the public sphere, police and privacy issues, same sex marriage....and you could even argue that the conservatives' lack of leadership on climate issues and environmental issues is also restrictive, in that it restricts the rights of all Canadians for a healthy environment free of toxic and dangerous contaminants.

    >> Bethany, that is quite a stretch...'restricts rights of Cdns for healthy environment'? The same Cdns who created said contaminants and continue to benefit by being able to feed their families from the jobs?

    I am so sick of this kind of alarmism. We produced far more and dangerous chemicals back in the 60's/70's, and have cleaned most of it up. The Conservatives have created more parkland, and restricted more dangerous chemicals than any other party. Ooops, they didn't give into the minority selling the wealth transfering Kyoto scheme - bfd. Stop your vendetta to score 'cool points' with your latte friends.
  37. Sylvia Wilson from Canada writes: By the way, I am not fetish about having a green lawn. Didn't plant any grass seed or put turf down. My entire lot was mostly left natural dotted with beds where I plant flowers and perennial bushes.

    I just need the use of Round Up for noxious weeds that cause an allergic reaction to anyone that comes into contact with it. I'm not about to go out and pour vinegar on these weeds several times throughout the year when Round Up effectively kills them with one application.
  38. Mahatma Gandhi from Calgary, Canada writes: PANIC! At The Ice Floe from Ottawa, Canada writes: Can anyone tell me why it is that Liberal and NDP are the first to demand restrictions of rights, yet the Conservatives are the least likely to impose one???

    Nobody has a 'right' to put herbicides into the environment. As you know, Canadian rights and freedoms are defined in the Charter, which was introduced by Trudeau. Diefenbaker had earlier introduced a Canadian Bill of rights, although this was a toothless and ineffective instrument.

    This has nothing to do with property rights. Check your title deed: It doesn't say anything about the air or the groundwater. Whether you like it or not, your esthetic decisions can affect the health of the environment and other people. Bear in mind that many of these herbicides are derived from the same toxins as defoliating agents like the infamous Agent Orange.

    You like grass? Go for a walk in the park. It's specially nice if you go with a friend.
  39. a cam from Canada writes: Why anyone would want a manicured lawn is beyond me. We spend more electricity pumping water up to the suburbs than we do on traffic lights, street lighting and energized rail. Then on the other end of the tube there is some nitwit with a hose in one hand and a bottle of killex in the other.
  40. guy tozer from Saskatoon, Canada writes: I hate cutting grass, so this year, we are going to remove the front lawn and replace with rocks and stone. Like so many posters have stated, 'lighten up, it's just grass'.
  41. roy f from van, Canada writes: 'gardening diehards'??
    More like gardening die-jobs.
    Get real, people. As in real grass that doesn't pollute our waterways.
  42. Nathan Weatherdon from Canada writes: Surely the burden of proof should fall on the pesticide manufacturers (to prove that it's safe) rather than the other way around. The perverse way that many people seem to see this (that the unsafeness has to be proven instead)
  43. Dick Nails from Canada writes: guy tozer from Saskatoon, Canada writes: I hate cutting grass, so this year, we are going to remove the front lawn and replace with rocks and stone. Like so many posters have stated, 'lighten up, it's just grass'.

    >> Yeah an property values will streek up for those houses with rocks, weeds and dirt out front and around the back an sides. There will be a complete reversal on how we view lawns after the revolution. Green lawn = eco-criminal. Jail or worse, now. Be a good comrade, give up and realize higher property values. So when after when the state nationalizes property (which is obviously a crime against the poor and those that don't or can't own houses), your payout will be a nice letter saying thanks for the house, now get out.
  44. Anne Peterson from Canada writes: The connection between Parkinsons and pesticide has been proven. And you can tell by the smell that it reaches beyond your own yard. Who cares if your lawn is perfect anyway. I sure don't.
  45. The Oracle from Caiman Islands, Canada writes: And this guy has no idea of what a fool he appears?
  46. S. Ives from Ottawa, Canada writes: I have a crummy lawn. I don't care.

    I have an iris garden.

    Next year, I won't, unless I use an extremely expensive nematode solution. Your standard grub nematode doesn't work well with iris borer; but the one that does is not winter hardy.

    'Merit', applied once as a granular mix, does the job. It's an improvement over Cygon 2E. Unfortunately, the lawn companies will not apply 'Merit' to my garden, because it is only supposed to be used for lawns. Crazy.

    And my neighbours trust me.
  47. Mahatma Gandhi from Calgary, Canada writes: Knowledge is True Opinion from Canada writes: You can't burn tires on yoru lawn, but damn it, it's my property and I have the right to do what I want.

    What are you, 6? No, you don't have the right to do what you want. Grow up.
  48. bethany middleton from Canada writes: Howard Roark: latte friends? that's funny! I don't even drink coffee...and if I did, it certainly wouldn't be latte, it would be espresso, straight up. Nice try at the insult game, but it doesn't make your argument hold water.
  49. Knowledge is True Opinion from Canada writes: Mahatma, sarcasm was missed on that one. Check my other posts. Especially the one with all caps.

    There is so much garbage on these forumns I can't read them all either.
  50. Dick Nails from Canada writes: Here's a great idea for you active activists: spray gasoline of lawns that offend you. As noted by some real good comrades here, you have no property rights. That really means that if someone's lawn disturbs you, you have the right to destroy it. So please, comrades, join is in the war against lawns. Tdoay, front lawns, tomorrow the back and then onto golf courses and anything that is privately held (for the time until the revy) and has a lawn. Lawns are crimes.
  51. Howard Roark from Whitby, Canada writes: Bethany,
    You missed the point I was making. The points you were making are typical of the elitist/alarmist attitude that is prevalent in today's society. I was not trying to 'insult' you, but to comment on how common this seems to be getting. It is not based on reason, but on friends convincing friends, with no ties to truth.

    You retorted on my 'insult'...I would have more respect if you countered the crux of my argument.
  52. Cara S from Canada writes: I think everyone has the right to a green lawn, bylaw bedamned!

    I happen to live next to a person like you who loves spraying his lawn with pesticides. But I don't mind. Really. It doesn't matter that every summer my mother gets headaches and sore throats when my neighbour plies his lawn with chemicals, because he gets a beautiful green lawn, and really, that's what truly matters, right? I mean, we can keep our windows shut, right? So what if we don't have AC and temps reach into the 40s -- everyone knows a green lawn is essential to an enjoyable summer.

    Oh, and when pesticide-users water their lawns (because the chemicals are drying it out faster than it would naturally) and those chemicals go in to the water table, there's nothing to worry about -- everyone could use a healthy dose of chemicals that are linked to cancer and endocrine disruption. Hey, if the pesticides don't cause cancer, that plastic cup you drink out of all day will, right?

    So go ahead and have that green lawn! Screw the kids in your neighbourhood ... the dogs that get walked along your street ... the neighbours who are sensitive to the chemicals in the pesticides you're using ... your children/grandchildren... You're going to have one hell of a sexy lawn. Spray on, green grass lovers, spray on.
  53. Howard Roark from Whitby, Canada writes: Dick Nails:

    LOL! Love it. Although you got to wonder of some of these activists/alarmists will actually take your advice....
  54. Nassar Ben Houdja from Canada writes: The only way the ninny (happy now nanny panderers?) state will be able to enforce the litany of baaaans is to have the friends, family and neighbors spy on each other. After turning someone in, east german style, the ninnys will awarded 'Hero' medals to the patriotic, the convicted will be sent to re-education camps. Of course a whole department of the government will be required for this, glad Ontario can afford all the civil servants they demand.
  55. Betty Davis from Toronto, Canada writes: Well put Mark Hathaway. Unfortunately people have bought into the idea that pesticides and herbicides are the only way you can obtain a 'perfect lawn'. My other peeve about lawns are the people who waste water trying to keep them green in the middle of summer. What a waste of a value resource.
  56. bruce weaver from Canada writes: The Park I take my Mom to is one big weed infested dump in Toronto.
  57. aniphylactic shock troops from Victoria, Canada writes: I'm libertarian so I worry about property rights more than the next guy. But property rigths do not extend to poisoning the environment. And lawn chemicals leach into ground water, rivers and oceans almost without bothering to spend any time where you place them. Banning chemicals for lawn control is long, LONG overdue.
  58. Rheanna Leckie from Canada writes: I agree, Betty - and people who water their driveways bother me even more. My parents can't do their laundry at home because there's not enough water, and meanwhile their neighbours are merrily pouring it out on the ground all day.

    I don't really understand why people think weeds are so ugly. I always welcomed the sight of sunny yellow dandelions livening up the landscape to tell me summer's here. I guess it's just the societal norm of The Way Things Must Be Done, though, and people aren't willing to consider alternatives.

    Bruce: Maybe you could take your mom out to the Rouge Valley, or another natural area, instead of a park? Toronto actually has some very nice ones.
  59. jack Bauer from Canada writes: Betty in my neighborhood development is only stopped by the lack of water. Every time they find a way to save water some more houses go up. So needless to say I water like heck everychance I get, even if there is a water ban I will let it go out the back. In the end I am being the best environmentlist as large water use stops development! I encourage everyone to do this if your municipality has the same problem!
  60. ray say from Canada writes: Aren't Canadians lucky that we have the time, liberty, and resources to sweat the small stuff - like this debate!

    Blog on, I say!
  61. Tony Mareschealle from mississauga, Canada writes: And don't expect your property taxes to drop either when your property looks like an overgrown weed dump - even if the resale vales does
  62. puddin and pie from Canada writes: better not eat any products grown on Canadian grain farms.
    Lotsa herbicides used on the prairies.

    no more timmies donuts
    no more molsons, labatts
    no more granola
    for all the worry-warts
  63. C C from Coombs BC, Canada writes: This is just wrong. I support the grouping of humans into cities and advocate shunning the country, where I live, as it's just to boring. The right of city dwellers to poison themselves should not be abrogated as it is a good way to reduce trips out into the country which I strongly discourage.

    Stay home it's much better and safer too.
  64. L Z from Canada writes: since when was a perfect lawn so important? is it a status thing? it is not as important as the health of our children.

    most importantly: chemicals do not heed to the boundaries of our lawns. suggesting that we keep off grass that has been sprayed as a means to avoiding the health affects is very nieve.

    consider researching the type of grass you have. it may not be native to your area and that is why it needs chemicals to hold up. nature seems to have done just fine without them all these years, so people, we're smart, we put people on the moon and conduct brain surgery, why can't we manage our lawns without harmful chemicals?!

    exactly, we can!

    warning: you may have to miss an episode of opera to put in the extra elbow grease.
  65. Katie Marshall from Canada writes: I wonder if The Globe realizes that not all nematodes are parasitic? The phylum contains over 80,000 species, of which only about 15,000 are parasitic.
  66. Mahatma Gandhi from Calgary, Canada writes: Knowledge is True Opinion from Canada writes: Mahatma, sarcasm was missed on that one.

    Ah, sorry. In my defense, some of these postings are so outrageous that it's hard to tell sometimes between sarcasm and the real thing.
  67. Mike Michaels from Toronto Expat, United States writes: The ban should apply to golf courses as well.
  68. Wide Awake from Canada writes: Key words: 'when used as directed'. Farmers, golf courses and city parks are likely to use them 'as directed' because there are $$ involved.

    Unfortunately, homeowners will use as much as 6x the recommended amounts (Roundup in a spray bottle) because they have a miniscule amount of acreage but bought a whole bottle and one squirt just doesn't look like it could possibly be enough.

    That's the real danger of urban exposure.
  69. Doug - from Canada writes: We don't have a lawn, rock, flowers bushes. Was hard work putting in but no works for me after and my wife has only spring and fall clean up stuff. Uses very little water due to mulch. Its a pie shaped lot so even if we had grass there would be very little in the front. Actually a couple of neighbours copied us in the front by getting rid of there front lawns.
  70. Dick Nails from Canada writes: Rheanna Leckie from Canada writes: Dick Nails: Clearly you're missing the point entirely. Allow me to explain.

    >> I missed the point? Hardly. I pounced, pounded, pummelled and murderized it. I won the point, game and match. Match... gasoline? I think there is a link. I am so like, against lawns that I would advise somebody who really, really hates them to do something. Me? I am an inactve activist. I lost my nerve back in the 60s when my ball cap got lost in a tussle at the ROTC. Since then I am only advising destroying the state, not actually doing anything.

    Lawns = criminals. Jail or worse, now. Are you with me? Good. Go do something. I am counting on you. Get the point?
  71. Dick Nails from Canada writes: aniphylactic shock troops from Victoria, Canada writes: I'm libertarian so...

    >> No, what you mean is I'm a librarian but... you love the state to tell us where, what, when and how (there is no why) how to live our lives. That is good. We are here to serve the state and only the state. Bring back Mao and Stallin. Good guys with a bad rep. I mean, what 70M murders between them? Could have been a lot or even worse. So geen lawns = criminals. Brown fields, yeah!
  72. Dick Nails from Canada writes: Huge Crapper from Vancouver, Canada writes: M Clarke from Canada writes: I don't understand people's fetish for perfectly manicured lawns. Why do people need gardens that look like golf greens?

    It's actually a sign of obsessiveness and a reflection of mental illness and lack of rationale.

    >> Absolutely dood. Dr Crapper here knows what he knows. Neat is bad, neat is criminals and logically a neat person with a green lawn is a criminal. How simple. Thanks Dr Crapper.
  73. Sue City from Ottawa, Canada writes: Who gives a flying fahoolie about who's lawn is greener... It's elitism! (My lawn is greener than your lawn. ugh, barf...)

    These people should get a real hobby. Or, better yet, go for a walk in the woods and see how beautiful nature can be - unmanicured.

    These are the people who buy a beautiful lakeside property and then mow down every last inch, right to the water's edge. Wasted beauty.
  74. Dick Nails from Canada writes: If I ever buy a house, I am paving the front lawn (and back the year after) with 4 inches of nice asshfault. Nothing will break thru that cover. And if it does, I will pour gas over the whole thing and set fire to it. Not only will I go beyond brown, I am going black. And once you go black you can't go back. So you wimps that are stuck with weeds, dirt, sticks and rocks: get moving, get paving and get with the future program. Pave now and save the future from the past.
  75. Dick Nails from Canada writes: Mike Michaels from Toronto Expat, United States writes: The ban should apply to golf courses as well.

    >> Dood, get with the program. Golfers are... what is the word, boourgeoises? No more golf. Pave it now.
  76. Knowledge is True Opinion from Canada writes: Dick Nails, the city wont let you do that either. Ha
  77. todd walker from san antonio, United States writes: The tone of this story is very clear, as are the opinions of those interviewed. They are obviously uncognizant of the fact that they are applying persistent toxins to not just their yard but also my water and my air - not to mention the toxins released in the manufacture of these products. Why not just roll us all in pcb's and be done with it!
  78. PANIC! At The Ice Floe from Ottawa, Canada writes: todd walker from san antonio, United States writes: The tone of this story is very clear, as are the opinions of those interviewed. They are obviously uncognizant of the fact that they are applying persistent toxins to not just their yard but also my water and my air



    Last I checked, San Antonio wasn't part of Ontario. Therefore, it's not YOUR water nor YOUR air.

    I guess the cavalry has been called in...
  79. Green Canada from Canada writes: it has nothing to do with property rights people...if these products were not manufactured and marketted in the first place how exactly would your property right change. This is purely about getting unncessary products that have some risks associated with them off the market. ...and yes I would prefer to see more invertebrates, from bees to spiders, in our gardens.
  80. Dick Nails from Canada writes: Knowledge is True Opinion from Canada writes: Dick Nails, the city wont let you do that either. Ha

    >> What, pave my lawn? Why not? I am being extra-eco-sensitive and am totally against lawns. Paving is the future and the past. Look around, there is ashsfphault everywhere so it must be good. I rest on the case.
  81. Dick Nails from Canada writes: Green Canada from Canada writes: it has nothing to do with property rights people...if these products were not manufactured and marketted in the first place how exactly would your property right change. This is purely about getting unncessary products that have some risks associated with them off the market. ...and yes I would prefer to see more invertebrates, from bees to spiders, in our gardens.

    >> How about carpenter ants, termites, roaches and other city-fied, house loving fauna? Are you happy to have these little friends in the house too?
  82. aging oldtool from Canada writes: Vanity is such an emotion generator. Why is it people are so shallow they believe a green lawn is a sign of anything but the product of an anally challenged homeowner? Why a green lawn? It's not like the green actually represents green as in environmental health or practices. All it says to anyone who is aware is that the homeowner is somewhat obsessed. Of course it also says the homeowner is quite willing to poison the ground, ground water and the environment to satisfy his/her egotistical wants. What is needed is a bit more policing of the rules but a real change in the penalties so that the likes of the gentleman interviewed in this article start to realize they can no longer thumb their nose at eveyone else. A month of community service picking real weeds by hand on city parklands might be a starter. I'd urge anyone with a vegetable garden any where near the property of a pesticide poison user to check for airborne drift or leeching of the chemicals into your garden. If you find any sue the every last speck of green out of your neighbour and then lobby for a environmental offender registry. Canadians have a right to live safely on their own property without the risk of some jerk who's too lazy to bend over spreading his poison through the neighbourhood. Besides, it's likely only time before the Monsantos of the world began claiming patent rights to new Round Upready lawn grasses and start suing the unsuspecting neighbours of their product users.
  83. Sue City from Ottawa, Canada writes: Dick, roll yourself in asphalt, would ya? (BTW, that's how you spell it.)
  84. Dick Nails from Canada writes: aging oldtool from Canada: ... What is needed is a bit more policing of the rules but a real change in the penalties so that the likes of the gentleman interviewed in this article start to realize they can no longer thumb their nose at eveyone else. A month of community service picking real weeds by hand on city parklands might be a starter.

    >> Hey, I am working the eco-zealot, hate humanity, jail the offendors, we might cut your hand off next time crazy side of the street. Find your own crazy, this thread is mine. Now back off old fool.
  85. Dick Nails from Canada writes: Sue City from Ottawa, Canada writes: Dick, roll yourself in asphalt, would ya? (BTW, that's how you spell it.)

    >> It? I spell 'it' it. What are you driving at? I don't want to roll in it, I want to pave lawns. We are all agreed here except for the crazies, that lawns are bad. So when I say pave you say 'it'. Why are you confused? You like lawns? Lawns are demonstrably evi. Comrade Joe and Mow didn't have lawns and look where it got them? Even that Hilter fella didn't like lawns but he was a vegan. So now I am afraid of vegans. Vegans are bad. March with us next Dirt Day against vegans. We'll win and then start the paving.
  86. Daniel Cunningham from Victoria, writes: For those of you in love with pesticides and who are moaning about this ban, one phrase for you - suck it up buttercup!
  87. Sue City from Ottawa, Canada writes: Dick - you're crazy, man.

    =)
  88. Dick Nails from Canada writes: Sue City from Ottawa, Canada writes: Dick - you're crazy, man.

    >> You assume because my name is Dick I am a man. Well, maybe not.

    I am just getting ahead of the curve here. Come on people, don't be shy. This is the sort of thing that really got the Chinese Cultural Revy off the ground. I am hoping to hear about snitches to the ON eco-police about people who illegally import spray and use it. The govt can reposses the lawn, take the kids and jail the offendors. That is how liberal fascism works. Just look at what is posted here: eco-lib fascism dressed up as concern for the kids. 'I do this for the kids, not for me, the kids'.
  89. Michael B from Canada writes: screw the lawn enthusiasts. This is the world we are talking about. Time to stop sterilizing it for sheer aesthetics. I'm not hypocrite, and am not suggesting that lawn products are the worst offenders, but it certainly is a step in the right direction to ban pesticide use when it's really only for looks.

    I can't believe how arrogant and selfish these lawn owners are. Get a new hobby that doesn't help kill the world.
  90. aging oldtool from Canada writes: Hey Dick Nails. You need a file or something to sharpen up a little. I had to plead insanity to get on this forum and now you're suggesting I stole your gig.

    Besides those carpenter ants, roaches and 'other city-fied house loving fauna' you wonder about may soon be your new food source.

    When all the gardens have finally been cleared of earthworms and other good earth enriching bugs, your house pets will start to look pretty good.

    Of course, that advice comes with the caveat you are what you eat so be careful of dining on any that have glow in the dark eyes.

    And hey, call me an oldtool or even too cool, but go easy on that old fool handle. I'm really not that old, if you must know.
  91. Dick Nails from Canada writes: Michael B from Canada writes: screw the lawn enthusiasts. This is the world we are talking about. Time to stop sterilizing it for sheer aesthetics. I'm not hypocrite, and am not suggesting that lawn products are the worst offenders, but it certainly is a step in the right direction to ban pesticide use when it's really only for looks.

    I can't believe how arrogant and selfish these lawn owners are. Get a new hobby that doesn't help kill the world.

    >> We have a WINNER of the April 25 eco-liberal eco-fascist award. Take a bow, get a can of gas and get out there Mike. Those lawns won't go brown themselves.
  92. Knowledge is True Opinion from Canada writes: You know it's a good thread when facism get thrown around. Can Nazi comments be far behind?
  93. Peter Herbert from thunder bay, writes: I find if you mow them down, weeds look like grass. I have more weeds that grass in my yard but keeping it mowed looks good. I have never used anything to deal with them.
  94. Dick Nails from Canada writes: Knowledge is True Opinion from Canada writes: You know it's a good thread when facism get thrown around. Can Nazi comments be far behind?

    >> You are confused. One does not have to be a Nazi to be a fascist. Liberal fascists are all over this one. Here is another find example from the kitchen of Libby Fasc: nutrition is a state matter. The state will decide what is good for you to eat, remove the bad, promote what is determined to be good and you will eat it.
  95. Knowledge is True Opinion from Canada writes: I was just hoping someone would use the term 'lawn Nazis'
    It's the typical progression

    Rights and freedoms, communism, facism, nazi comments

    Sometimes we are lucky to get 1984 references thrown in as well.
  96. Knowledge is True Opinion from Canada writes: Now that pesticides are banned the government will suggest we eat grass. That way we can develop a network of stomach's like cows. Then we can produce methane and harness that methane to create a renewable (although stinky) energy source. You just aren't seeing the big picture here.
  97. David B from Canada writes: The comment section stinks from Canada, you and all of the other people who need the green lawn are missing the point. It's not the lawn that has the contaminants it's the rain runoff that runs right back into Lake Ontario, the source of our drinking water. If you want to go to Buffalo more power to you but I want you to put in a separate drainage system so you can capture the runoff from your yard. You drink it that way you can be buried under your nice lawn.
    I don't care how crappy a lawn looks my main concern is for the health of the community and eliminating ANY poison from our environment is a good thing. Period.
  98. Slander Us from Toronto, Canada writes: This is crazy! As someone who gets terrible migraines whenever my neighbour sprays his lawn, I have no sympathy for those that feel it's their right to spray chemicals. Someone is quoted here as saying just stay off my lawn, but it's not that simple. When the chemical is being sprayed, if there's a breeze it drifts. I have to close all my windows and stay inside when my neighbour does it - and that's not fair to me or my kids (my son also gets the migraine). So, to the people bashing this law, please keep in mind that your selfish attitude and ridiculous desire to have a perfect lawn DOES affect other people. I've talked to my neighbour about his spraying, and he told me to get lost or pull up the dandylions on his lawn. Funny thing with him though, he's staunchly against smoking in public and gets angry if people smoke near him - yet fails to see any irony in that.