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Panel divided on crusader's nomination, vote suggests

JANE TABER AND GLORIA GALLOWAY AND CAROLINE ALPHONSO

From Thursday's Globe and Mail

Latest comment posted at 8:30 PM EDT 02/07/08

Morgentaler defends his appointment; B.C. priest to return Order of Canada in protest ...Read the full article

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  1. Green Milos from Canada writes: Is he honoured that he's devalued the Order to the point where real recipients are about to hand theirs back? The Order of Canada is worthless now.
  2. F P from Toronto, Canada writes: Why does religion creat so much hate?
  3. Billy Bee from Canada writes: Congrats, Mr Morgentaler. Its takes a great man to initiate and make change happen (something we rarely see in political circles, i.e. do-nothing Chretien and Harper, who may as well take his orders from GWB)

    Unfortunately I expect we'll see Harper and his cadre of NeoCon bible thumpers try to find a way to put a stop to your award being received.
  4. Mr X from Canada writes: A sad day for Canada. We are at the mercy of the liberal elite. Why anyone would pick this man is beyond me. The 'Order of Canada' just became a meaningless thing.
  5. H K from winnipeg, Canada writes: Congratulations to Dr. Morgentaller on this well-deserved award.
  6. urban ranger from Vancouver, Canada writes: Dr. Morgentaler deserves our respect and admiration.

    But I find it difficult to understand how anyone could be excited about becoming a member of the Order of Canada. It has lost most of its significance by being awarded to so many people who, unlike Dr. Morgentaler, have done nothing particularly outstanding.

  7. Shawn Bull from Canada writes: I am not sure I agree with Morgentaler receiving this award. When 50% of Canadians are uncomfortable with him being honoured then I think a seceond look must be taken.

    No matter what your stance is on abortion I don't think it makes a person qualified to be honoured just because he was the first of most aggressive at abortion. Did the pro-lifer who was as aggressive at stopping these as Morgentaler was at giving them also recieve this honour?
  8. Power Glide from Canada writes:

    As I see it, these awards are like the Academy Awards - done by and for the puffed up egos of the rich and famous. They affect the rest of us not one whit - so who cares who gets them.

    I think they are relatively cheap too, so they don't cost us that much, though I suppose there is some cost. Poor as I am, I can spare a few cents a year in tax to support the needs of these people.
  9. Rick Sieb from Edmonton, Canada writes: Didn't Morgentaler spend time in jail. I wouldn't think they would give the Order of Canada to someone who had been in jail. Someone shouldn't be rewarded for breaking the law.
  10. John Smith from Ottawa, Canada writes: He is a man truly deserving of the honour. He took an dangerous back alley operation and placed it it a proper medical facility, saving women's lives and having the process performed safely. He also brought the abortion issue to the fore, the majority of Canadians being pro-choice. I remember living across the street from Mr. Morgantaler's Toronto Harbord Street clinic where young women would walk a dangerous gauntlet of men who often would attempt to physically threaten the incoming patients. The compassion and good will of the staff was reassuring. Eventually, the Toronto police came in to protect the women from threats, and I must say that they were admirable in their efforts to protect the women. The neighborhood grew to love the police for their very presence. Mr. Mogantaler gave the women hope.

    I am also delighted to see that Kim Campbell is also receiving the Order of Canada on the same day. She put herself on a limb for her legal stand on the abortion issue. All in all, splendid choices for choice.
  11. Jorly fuster from Canada writes: Hey, if we gave it to a racist indian, why not an abortion performing doctor.
  12. Ed Op from Canada writes: Okay, either I'm the first to comment, or everything posted so far has not been approved by the censors. I'm going to guess it's the latter.

    For what it's worth, I know how passionate people can feel about abortion, but if it's a legal procedure (which it should be, and is) then Dr. Morgentaler's dedication to providing this service to women in a safe and supportive environment should indeed be honoured. I remember how aggressive 'anti-choice' protesters were at the time and it could not have been easy, and was probably quite often terrifying, to continue. Being against abortion shouldn't stop a person from at least seeing it from Morgentaler's perspective - he selflessly put an awful lot on the line to help women in need. That selfless devotion to others is what the Order of Canada is supposed to be about. I know there are those out there who think of abortion as murdering babies, but the Supreme Court of Canada, a large proportion of the medical and ethics communities and a majority of Canadians see it differently. You may disagree, but this is the reality. As such, Dr. Morgentaler is deserving of this honour.
  13. JA M from Our Town, Canada writes: This is the same honor that Conrad Black and Alan Eagleson have been given so I believe Dr. Morgentaler deserves to be awarded also.
  14. Kent Peacock from Lethbridge, Canada writes: Congratulations to Dr. Henry Morgentaler for his vision, courage, and hard work.
  15. Mike M from Canada writes: Former most prestigious honour.
  16. M. Mark from Victoria, Canada writes: Good comment by Stephane Dion.
  17. Shawn W from Toronto, Canada writes: He is certainly a controversial figure, but I think he deserves the award for stance on womens' rights.

    The Catholic Church or any other has no business interfering in the lives of ordinary Canadians. Indeed, with all the sex scandals that have gone on over the past number of decades it's quite amusing to see the bishops and priests acting like they have some kind of moral authority.
  18. Big Wayne Kerr from Kumbaya, Canada writes: Because there really is no issue, except that a Law to define and make clear a womans right to access safe abortion procedures still needs to be put in place.

    Why did the Liberals never put such a law in place with all their majorities?
    Looks bad on them.
    Could it be all the Catholic Fundamentalists in their party?
  19. Tom Paine from Every tory is a coward, Canada writes: Morgentaller definitely deserves to be honoured.

    On the other hand, The Order of Canada is such a shambles, I'm not sure that's good enough.

    The number of self-promoters, time-servers, and de riguer appointments in the Order is very high. Kim Campbell is made a companion why? Buzz Hargrove? Did either of these people ever do anything of note for clearly selfless reasons?

    Too many people are getting into the order for simply having done a well remunerated job without scandal.
  20. Gregory Azeff from Toronto, Canada writes: Morgentaler is being honoured for two reasons: (1) He is responsible for giving Canadian women more choice in their health issues; and (2) He worked toward this goal in the face of violent opposition from right-to-lifers. Regardless of how a person may feel about abortion itself, it is impossible to deny the personal sacrifices Dr. Morgentaler made over the last 3 decades in the pursuit of what he believed to be right.

    It doesn't take a hero to work toward a goal everyone agrees on. It does take a hero to do that work in the face of death threats, arson, bombings and the rest of the tactics used by those peace lovin' right wing zealots against Dr. Morgentaler (ah, the sweet sweet irony of it all...)
  21. Kitty Burgers from Hamilton, Canada writes: I'd like to know: just who are these people Dr. Morgentaler refers to as the 'Catholic Right'?
  22. Charvine Adl from Vancouver, Canada writes: No matter which side of the issue you sit on, the Order means nothing now that it has been given to someone who repeatedly broke (not challenged) the law and who divided (and still divides) the Nation. Disgusting.
  23. Hector 3339 from Toronto, Canada writes: F P from Toronto, Canada writes: Why does religion creat so much hate?

    I've always wondered the same thing. The Heritage Front wouldn't get away with as much as religion has and somehow that's been banned. And yet what else comes out of Mosques, Churches and Synagues, but prejudice, prejudice, prejudice. Who the good people are, and who the bad people are. Who deserves life and who does not...
  24. Alastair james Berry from Nanaimo BC CANADA, Canada writes:

    Not a moment too soon!

    Dr. Morgentaler is a man of vision, a man of compassion and a man of wisdom!

    Canada needs a Whole Army of men like him, with courage and moral fortitude, if we, as Canadians, are to survive into the 22nd. century!
  25. Are We Having This Conversation Again from Toronto, Canada writes: This is such a touchy subject on a person who did his work....despite the threats, protests, law suits etc.
    Did he do it for publicity? Did he do it because he truly cared for 'women's plight'? At this point, who really cares. He did something gutsy, even though people don't agree with his work, he is part of the reason women have a choice in terms of their body and what happens to their body.
    I consider myself a Christian, and although I do not agree with abortion, that does not mean that my beliefs and thoughts should be pressured on someone else!
    I am sure it takes courage to have an abortion (for whatever the reason!) and I am sure it is painful. For those women who have had it, you know your reasons and no one should ever judge you for that.
    For those who are against abortion....who are you to judge someone else? Sometimes we need to walk in other people's shoes in order to grasp their lives.
    On a side note, after Celine Dion received her Order, I really stopped caring! What has she 'really' done?
  26. Gardiner Westbound from Canada writes:
    Nominations are open for Josef Mengele for the Order of Canada. Seconders?

  27. Joseph Bloggins from Canada writes: An absolute farce which further cheapens the Order of Canada. It is now in the same league as the 'participant awards' that are given to kids in soccer tournaments who have won nothing.

    But more importantly it shows just how biased our judiciary is. The Chief Justice sits on the advisory council of the Order of Canada. Clearly this award shows the Chief Justice is biased in this regard and as such should never again be allowed to sit in judgement of anything related to the subject of abortion.

    A very sad day for Canada.
  28. Ruth Walker from Edmonton, Canada writes: The religious nuts need to lighten up a bit.

    HM is an important part of Canadian history. Setting aside all that he did to fight paternalistic, state control of women's bodies, his life is important for his contributions to our legal traditions, especially jury nullification.

    This Canadian is proud to see HM honored in this way!
  29. Hector 3339 from Toronto, Canada writes: Jorly fuster from Canada writes: Hey, if we gave it to a racist indian, why not an abortion performing doctor.

    Racism and abortion are two very different things. Racism has no intelligent basis, and cannot be ultimatly defended on a moralistic level. Abortion on the hand can indeed be a moralist and altruistic act. Especially in a society that values Conservatives who cut all kinds of social programs and alternatives to aleviate the need for abortion. Especially in societies where certain individuals based on race, gender, ability and sexual oritentation will be subjected to torment against the apathy of society.

    Perhaps, you should be asking of the Stephen Harper government or any kind of government for that matter to stop the cutting of women's programs. Or volunteer yourself to take in all the unwanted babies. Or tell society that there's no reason why a couple that is gay and just as loving and wanting of a child as a straight one can't have a baby.
  30. The Rev. Jeremiah Wright from Canada writes: Rick Sieb from Edmonton, Canada writes: 'Didn't Morgentaler spend time in jail. I wouldn't think they would give the Order of Canada to someone who had been in jail. Someone shouldn't be rewarded for breaking the law.' >>> This comment takes ignorance one step too far. Rosa Parks, Martin Luther King, Voltaire, Copernicus, Galileo, Socrates, even John McCain -- all these people spent time behind bars because they stood on principle, because they refused to bend to official injustice. Morgentaler belongs in this group of people; the law he broke was found to be UNCONSTITUTIONAL by the SCC -- Morgentaler literally changed the law, and put his whole life on the line to do it. There are very, very few people in Canada who would ever do this, and very many people (Rick Sieb from Edmonton being one of them) who refuse to see what an achievement that is. I suppose Rick Sieb would gladly toss Rosa Parks out of Arlington cemetery because she was arrested for refusing to sit at the back of a bus; I suppose John McCain is disqualified for running for president because he spent five years in a Vietnamese prison. Today, thanks to the Morgentaler nomination, for te first time in a long time, the Order of Canada actually means something.
  31. Jack Frost from Canada writes: 'Rick Sieb from Edmonton, Canada writes: Didn't Morgentaler spend time in jail. I wouldn't think they would give the Order of Canada to someone who had been in jail. Someone shouldn't be rewarded for breaking the law. '

    We should also take back any honours bestowed upon Nelson Mandela. That guy spent 27 years in the slammer!! What a crook!!
  32. Louis Riel from Canada writes: Credit to Dr. Morgentaler, although I don't agree with abortion or abortion on demand, I would NEVER stand in the way of a woman who has the right to choose, and Dr. Morgentaler fought to give all women the right to choose. He deserves the Order of Canada. This has nothing to do with religion either, no matter what the kooks say.
  33. Check your facts from Canada writes: Rick Sieb from Edmonton, Canada writes: Didn't Morgentaler spend time in jail. I wouldn't think they would give the Order of Canada to someone who had been in jail. Someone shouldn't be rewarded for breaking the law.

    Dr Morgentaler was eventually acquitted by the Supreme Court. So according to the Supreme Court, he did not break the law.
  34. Steve D from St. John's, Canada writes: Abortion doctor Henry Morgentaler says : '“I'm actually surprised that the reaction is not more violent than it is,&8221; Dr. Morgentaler said. &8220;There are many groups, especially on the fundamentalist side and the Catholic right, who are adamantly opposed to the rights of women to have abortions, especially safe abortions.&8221;'

    'safe abortions'?. You can't really call something safe when a person ends up dead in the process, can you.

    Sort of like 'safe executions' don't you think?

    To be honest, we are just opposed to a right to have an abortion. 'Safe' or otherwise, we are equally opposed. Not 'especially' so for safe ones if there is such a thing (see paragraph one). I would tell you one thing tho, we really do not like paying for it out of our taxes.

    As for him receiving an 'Order of Canada', since there is no law against abortion in Canada, he and the country deserve each other.
  35. verruckt verruckt from Canada writes: 1) This man has devalued the life of an unborn child to that of a wart or mole.
    2) He has contributed to the myth that sex outside marriage is harmless and we see that in the horrendous abortion and sexual transmitted disease rates etc.
    3) By way of his actions he has also cause considerable physical and emotional damage to many women that because of their abortion are now unable to get pregnant or feel guilt at the murder of their child.

    ... I wonder if the same people that would give Morgantoller an award would have given Dr. Josef Mengela an award too?
  36. The Rev. Jeremiah Wright from Canada writes: Charvine Adl from Vancouver, my above comments responding to Rick Sieb apply to you as well. Tell me, do you think Lech Walesa should have his Nobel Peace Prize taken away because the communists threw him in prison? Is Galileo nothing more than a petty thug because he challenged the Vatican's totally incorrect view of astronomy and was nearly burned at the stake? And YES, Morgentaler DID challenge Canada's abortion laws ... and won. The SCC said that he was right, and the law was wrong. To achieve that substantial victory, he had to spend serious time in jail. He sacrificed himself for a cause greater than himself. Tell me, Charvine Adl, what cause greater than yourself would you sacrifice your life for? Any? Until you can answer that question in a positive sense, I suggest you stop referring to people far greater, more important and courageous than you as 'disgusting.'
  37. CHP My vote from Whoville, Canada writes: Morgantaler says: 'I'm actually surprised that the reaction is not more violent than it is,” Dr. Morgentaler said. “There are many groups, especially on the fundamentalist side and the Catholic right, who are adamantly opposed to the rights of women to have abortions, especially safe abortions.”

    So, are you trying to turn yourself into a 'martyr' now? Are you inviting the 'more violent' people? I pray that one day before you die you see the wrong of your ways. Especially being so closely tied to the Holocaust, that you can't see the 'Holocaust' you're perpetrating on the hundreds of thousands of innocents every year.

    To put abortion under the guise of 'women's rights' is as much of a stretch as anything.
  38. The Wight from Canada writes: Charvine Adl:

    'No matter which side of the issue you sit on, the Order means nothing now that it has been given to someone who repeatedly broke (not challenged) the law and who divided (and still divides) the Nation. Disgusting.'

    Tell that to Rosa Parks who actually broke the law by sitting at the front of the bus in a nation that is still struggling with race to this day! Morality and legality are not the same thing.
  39. Mel B. from Ottawa, Canada writes: Congratulations to Dr. Morgentaler for his important work in women's health and women's rights.

    As a Canadian, I'm proud to see him honoured with the Order of Canada.
  40. Steve Not an Alberta Redneck from Calgary, Canada writes: I can think of few people who deserve this more than him.

    Wouldn't it be nice if the scum at anti abortion obstructions were subject to the same threat of violence that the heros of this fight were subject to?
  41. D M from Canada writes: Congratulations to Dr. Morgentaler.
  42. K M from Kitchener, Canada writes: Mother Teresa was asked by a journalist why she seemed to be frustrated by the 'West'. She answered, 'In the West a mother is allowed to kill her unborn baby. If the West has lost even this, then what else is there for the West to lose.'
    A sad day for Canada. A sadder day for children as we celebrate that pregnancies are terminated for convenience and economic reasons. Life cannot be devalued without loss to our society. Women's rights should be balanced with the rights of those unable to speak.
  43. R. Carriere from Maritimes, Canada writes:

    If one reads the criteria for the award, then scans the list of who has won it in the past, you will notice it is truly NOT what it was supposed to be.

    The list of names would certainly raise eyebrows, and appears to have much to do with actual political affiliation of the time, and less about 'accomplishment.'

    As for the 'good' doctor, and because of the dividing, and highly contentious nature of this issue, which clearly splits Canadians almost down the middle with strong feelings on both sides, I do not believe he should be awarded.
    .
  44. Bob Cajun from coboconk, Canada writes: Rick Sieb from Edmonton, Canada writes: Didn't Morgentaler spend time in jail. I wouldn't think they would give the Order of Canada to someone who had been in jail. Someone shouldn't be rewarded for breaking the law.

    Why? They didn't take away Conrad Black's Order of Canada, either when he renounced his citizenship or went to jail
  45. Christa Bedwin from Canada writes: Hurray, Dr. Morgentaler, and thank you so much for caring about me, and other women.
    I will still choose not to have an abortion, but it's wonderfully liberating and emancipating to have the choice for my own health and well-being.

    Bravo for being strong enough and brave enough to weather the haters and naysayers.

    Religion should not cause hate, especially not hatred of individuals, which anti-choicers espouse.

    Jesus loved individuals, and I never saw a picture of him carrying a sword, a bomb, or handcuffs. Neither should you try to restrict and debase your fellow man if you love Jesus and/or any variety of God and/or right thinking.
  46. D. Hall from Wpg, Canada writes: Congratulations to Dr. Morgentaller
  47. Bart Farquart from Canada writes:
    An abortionist gets one. A convicted fraudster and justice obstructor keeps his. An anti-semitic wack job gets his taken away. Ditto for a professional hockey swindler.

    When do I get mine?

    What a gong show.
  48. Professional30smthg in TO from Canada writes: Urban Ranger and Power Glide, I agree completely. The Order of Canada was a worthless symbol of political connections long before today.

    But hey, at least they didn't find some way to give it to Al Gore.
  49. Red-necked and loving it from Canada writes: Hector 3339 from Toronto, Canada writes: Or volunteer yourself to take in all the unwanted babies. Or tell society that there's no reason why a couple that is gay and just as loving and wanting of a child as a straight one can't have a baby.

    There's a line nine miles long for babies. People are going as far as China or Romania to adopt so that's not a problem. As for why gays can't have babies, you'll just have to look it up under 'reproduction - who can and who can't'. Hint - two males can't, neither can two females, takes one of each.
  50. Ed Op from Canada writes: What's more interesting to me here once I think about it a bit is how worried Harper's gang is about this. My God! We can't let our 'grassroots' back home in Alberta think we were in favour of this! Quick! Get out the talking points! Make sure everyone knows we didn't have anything to do with it!

    So if I understand correctly, this government is very proud to have sent young Canadian men and women to Afghanistan to kill and be killed but horrified at the thought of an honour being bestowed on someone who risked his own life and liberty to protect the rights of women over their own bodies and to ensure there was a safe alternative to the alleyway abortion.

    So I guess this means that Harper and his core supporters feel that a partially developed fetus is more deserving of eventual life (regardless of the cost to the mother, society or anything else) than a Canadian soldier or Afghan citizen. That's fine. Just don't any of you Harpercrites dare go on about 'every life is sacred' or some such thing.
  51. Hans Ulster from Low Earth Orbit, Canada writes: F P from Toronto, Canada writes: Why does religion create so much hate?

    ---------------------

    Can't you just feel the love with every aborted fetus?
  52. Big Wayne Kerr from Kumbaya, Canada writes: verruckt verruckt etc,

    Please.

    HM valued the actual existing lives of existing women so that they did not die from unsafe abortions. He saved lives. And he put an end to the hypocrisy of well-connected rich decision makers getting safe illegal/foreign abortions for their family memebers while keeping safe abortions illegal and impossible for the poor and less well connected.
    Sending women off to die from the dirty coathanger is all the anti-choice people ever did.

    And if you are still wondering who the Catholic Right are, look in the LPC, you'll find them there.
  53. Ted Andrews from Canada writes:
    Congratulations Doctor.
    Freedom for women from back alley abortions.
  54. Alastair james Berry from Nanaimo BC CANADA, Canada writes:
    May I be permitted to say that I am astonished at some of the negative biased opinions that are being bandied about in this commentary against Dr Morgentaler?

    That a man of honour should be pilloried in this way, casts a stain on Canada's reputation of being a fair and balanced country!

    There used to be a saying about the KETTLE calling the POT BLACK, but it appears that many of the individuals here denigrating this great man , are, as the Bible says, 'Casting stones' without assessing their own deficiencies.
  55. The Rev. Jeremiah Wright from Canada writes: I find it very strange that the pro-life crowd sees legalized abortion as evidence that the West is 'devaluing' human life. A century ago, abortion was illegal, but it was legal to hire children in factories, and if they got killed, there was no recourse -- it was just 'the cost of doing business.' A century ago, abortion was illegal, but women didn't have the vote. Half the human population wasn't considered worthy of being a 'person.' I would say that today we live in the most life-valuing society the world has ever seen -- and for precisely that reason, abortion is legal.
  56. Billy Bee from Canada writes: To those strongly opposed to abortion:

    Thanks to Dr Morgentaller our sisters, aunts, mothers and wives have a choice to terminate a pregnancy with the assistance of trained professionals in modern, clean facilities.

    If you banned abortion it would still happen - in seedy backrooms by untrained 'doctors.' Which one do you want for your sister?
  57. Tom h from Edmonton, Canada writes: Rick Sieb from Edmonton, Canada writes: Didn't Morgentaler spend time in jail. I wouldn't think they would give the Order of Canada to someone who had been in jail. Someone shouldn't be rewarded for breaking the law.

    Didn't Nelson Mandela spend time in jail, too?

    (No, I'm not equating these two men - just pointing out the idiocy of your argument. Bad laws would never change if people like Dr. Morgentaler didn't challenge them.)
  58. albert rose from Canada writes: What does being anti-abortion have to do, necessarily, with religion? Can't one object to killing babies without invoking theology?

    The order of Canada has been diluted even further.
  59. Cuban Cigar from Canada writes: Congratulations, Mr. Morgentaller. Well deserved.
  60. Martyn Whitt from toronto, Canada writes: To those who love to throw out the Orwellian-esque phrase about a 'woman's right to chose', will you allow those women who chose to have an abortion to have an enormous sense of loss and guilt that will affect them deeply in later years or does that run contrary to your agenda?

    And no I'm not a religious nut, never have I been a member of any religious group and never have been. I just understand that most women are scarred pyschologically by this act (especially in later years when they do chose to start and raise a family)-something the abortionist absolutists wouldn't want a soul to hear about...shhhh!!!!
  61. Fake Name from Canada writes: 'Rick Sieb from Edmonton, Canada writes: Didn't Morgentaler spend time in jail. I wouldn't think they would give the Order of Canada to someone who had been in jail. Someone shouldn't be rewarded for breaking the law. '

    Yes, because the law is always right and just. While I wouldn't exactly compare the doctor to Rosa Parks in terms of actions, breaking a bayou can't really say that everyone who broke an unjust law in the past (as a political statement or not) is forever tainted by it.
  62. Lyn Alg from Canada writes: How about Conrad Black? Does he get to keep his medal? Alan Eagleson certainly didn't. The joke of it all ! I have an excellent suggestion. Why don't they insert an Order Of Canada medal in every box of Cracker Jacks?
  63. Hector 3339 from Toronto, Canada writes: Ok, God freaks before you go on with your moralistic arguments based on 'God' can someone please prove the existence of 'God' in empirical levels. If there is no proof of 'God' then the 'God' argument has not validity.
  64. henk gal from Canada writes: Kitty Burgers from Hamilton, Canada writes: I'd like to know: just who are these people Dr. Morgentaler refers to as the 'Catholic Right'?
    I know what the church teaches about abortion. I also know that not all catholics agree with the church's teaching, that they are pro-choice (but not necessarily pro-abortion). The people who are against abortion no matter what (and that includes the church's leaders), are probably the 'catholic right' Morgentaler has in mind. They call themselves 'pro-life'.
    Personally, I stay away from pro-life types because I have found them to be very fanatical, very harsh and judgmental, not willing to see that this issue isn't quite black and white; also. they are often single-issue catholics. And while very protective of the unborn (which is OK with me), I have yet to see them getting excited about the many thousands of children that die EVERY DAY from very preventable causes. Also, I have met pro-life people who defend the death penalty.
    I must say that the pro-life organization is changing its tune here and there in that they are becoming less harsh and more compassionate and understanding in their stance. I think that this is the way to go to have a proper debate/discussion about abortin, etc. A sledgehammer approach isn't very helpful.
  65. The Wight from Canada writes: I had the misfortune of seeing the inside of a Morgenthaler clinic first hand, many years ago.

    I was the only guy in the place (other than the armed guards) and the entire group of roughly 20-40 people were middle-aged mothers in there with their teenage daughters. I was an instant pariah, of course, but one mother was brave enough to commend me for showing up. None of their daughter's boyfriends could be bothered.

    Seriously, I hope the RW wing eventually wakes up. This isn't a pack of mid-30s yuppies using the service as contraception. It's mostly a bunch of scared teenage kids who got in way over their heads and are now paying for it, with often no one to help them but Mom and Dr. M.

    They aren't saving children by picketing and physically threatening these kids on the way into the clinic. The alternative is not safe and happy kids being raised by strangers. The alternative is scared, illogical pregnant teens stabbing themselves with implements, drinking known poisons to kill the fetus, punching themselves in the stomach to abort (or getting the boyfriend to do it) or, if you are lucky, seeing someone with actual experience in a back alley working illegally. The same mentality that has new mothers dropping their children in a bathroom stall and leaving it in the trashcan is in play.

    Yes, they could put it up for adoption, but that's been an option for decades, the demand is obviously there, and we're still seeing babies in dumpsters, aren't we?
  66. retired Catholic teacher from Calgary, Canada writes: Don’t want to confuse people with the facts however here are just a few stats on the subject:
    70,000 women die annually world wide due to unsafe illegal abortions, 186 die every day
    20 million unsafe illegal and 26 million legal abortions are performed each year according to the World Health Organization.
    Complications from illegal abortions are the second leading cause of deaths in hospitals in some developing countries.
    1 in 10 pregnancies end in unsafe abortions globally.
    50% of hospital budgets in some developing countries go to the treatment of complications from illegal abortions
    The Netherlands which provides free access to abortion services has the world’s lowest rate of abortions.
    Legalizing abortion in South Africa reduced the mortality rate due to illegal abortions by 90%.
    Legalizing abortion saves women’s lives and reduces the rate of abortions.
    Congrats to the Good Doctor!
  67. Billy Bee from Canada writes: Steve Not an Alberta Redneck from Calgary, Canada writes: 'Wouldn't it be nice if the scum at anti abortion obstructions were subject to the same threat of violence that the heros of this fight were subject to?' Agreed. They claim that all human life is sacred and then attack (and kill) doctors. Huh? Not exactly the forgiving type, are they? Far-right ant-abortionist = Christian jihadist (one is a terrorist, the other a criminal - decide which one is which for yourself)
  68. C A from Canada writes: NEWSFLASH:

    when you have an abortion you are 'killing' a fetus that is basically a little ball of mush, not a baby or child or whatever the nutjob anti abortionists like to chant and stomp their feet about...

    religious folk are the most unreasonable and ignorant people out there... OH YEAH BABY, I SAID IT!

    Congrats Dr. Morgentaler... Although i've never had a abortion and probably never will, I thank you for fighting for the rights of myself and woman alike... it takes a strong person with strong will and convictions to charge through such adversities and come out victorious!
  69. Babbleon ! from Sarnia, Canada writes: There is 100 awards given each year and there is more than 4000 on the list.
    Hey Bobby Clark the hockey player has one.
    These are handed out a dime a dozen you should see some of the names on the list.
  70. Billy Bee from Canada writes: Steve D from St. John's, Canada writes: To be honest, we are just opposed to a right to have an abortion. 'Safe' or otherwise, we are equally opposed.

    Don't count me in your 'We,' Steve. I feel strongly its a woman's right to choose - not yours, or mine.
  71. lets think from Canada writes: Congratulation!

    I am not for abortion, prevention is much better, but better than back alley acts of desperation.

    As the for the Catholic critics: until you clean up your acts, admit to abusing children and natives, admit that girls will have sex (catholic or not) and needs vaccination, stop girls wearing miniskirts that keeps men horny, love others regardless of sex and religion and belief, stop wearing red Prada shoes etc etc....continue to keep your heads in the sand and please don't cast the first stone.
  72. Hairy Wrangellian from Saltspring Island, Canada writes: I'm sure the selection committee knew there would be backlash from those that would prefer that women have their abortions with coat hangers in back alleys, but I'm glad they had the courage to honour Dr. Morgentaler.
  73. Always Right from Canada writes:

    Religious zealots unite. Impose your will on everyone. Tell people what's best for them, then kill them if they disagree with you.

    Congratulations Dr. Morgentaler. You are a pillar of freedom and an example for all forward thinking rational people.
  74. D C from Canada writes: If someone were to start conducting the 'safe' removal of organs for the purpose of selling them - would they be given the award? That's the whole 'it's my body' argument, right? We have set a precedent that can easily go awry. Sad.
  75. John Zylstra from Bluesky, Canada writes: I wonder what people would say if someone argued that it was too bad that Morgentaler himself was not aborted; He wouldn't have had to suffer during the holocaust, and he wouldn't be the cause of death of thousands of unborn humans.

    Certainly the order of Canda has now become a joke.
  76. CD W from Canada writes: When I see him with the award, I am reminded of all of the Catholic Liberal members of parliament who went along with abortion. The church really needs to do its' liturgical duty to excommunicate these men and women, for they are behaving as protestants of the United Church of Canada, and they dont believe in any sin any more. Let the hankster have his snowflake, and let us remember that abortion is no longer about the physical health of the woman but her need for birth control through murder. Hey, did I say that out loud?
  77. J. D. from Hamilton, ON, Canada writes: Dr. Morgentaler was twice charged with performing illegal abortions and procuring 'miscarriages' (1973 in Quebec, 1983 in Ontario), and was found innocent by a jury of his peers both times.

    Both times his jury verdict was overturned, upon Crown appeal, by a committee of judges.

    He deserves this award based solely upon the principled stand he took in order to see this ridiculous process brought to an end.

    If you value your Charter Right 'not to be arbitrarily detained or imprisoned' you ought to be grateful that a man like Morgentaler risked his own freedom to defend it.
  78. Leon Russell from Gatineau, Qc, Canada writes: Well if they can give one to Conrad Black...
  79. J Hare from Saskatoon, Canada writes: Wow, the comment stream is still open. Better post something before it closes again.

    James Hare
  80. Rob Bairos from Toronto, Canada writes: Not to take sides either way, but in the case of Terry Schiavo (the woman with a severly dimished vegetative brain showing no congnitive function), why is okay to end her life, but not an individual who does not have anything we could call a brain to begin with?
  81. Honesty is the best Policy from Canada writes:

    Congratulations, Mr. Morgentaler. Well deserved.

    .
  82. OLP AGM beer a from Canada writes: Actually soon two men and two women will be able to produce a biological baby. Scientist can now turn egg cells into sperm cells and im pretty sure they can make egg cells too. Google it haha.

    Anyways the baby killer does deserve the award as the award goes to bad people right?

    On a side note. A lot of protestants (not the United Church though) are against abortion too. Also a lot of non-religious people are against murdering babies too.
  83. Ron Bourgeois from Vancouver, Canada writes: Why all the fuss.

    The inconsistent history of who and how people have been awarded the Order of Canada has tarnished it a long time ago. Although I am not a supporter of Dr. Morgentaler, I didn't lose any sleep.

    All I can add to the conversation that my friends in Westmount knew back in the 1960s that if you got a girl in trouble call Dr. Morgentaler. His conversion to the 'Pro Choice' movement came after he was caught.
  84. J Hare from Saskatoon, Canada writes: While I respect the determination of Dr. Morgentaler, I have grave concerns about his cause. If the order of Canada is about uniting the country though celebration of people who achieved then I'm not sure Dr. Morgentaler fits as abortion is still an unsettled and divisive issue as the posts here demonstrate and suveys confirm. If there is balance then someone equally deserving from the opposing side should be nominated no? As a secularist and an agnostic, I find in disengenuious that everytime abortion is raised religious figures are used as a stand in for one side. Hiding from issues such as this by either preventing dialogue or avoiding discussion does not provide any answer except to show a cowardly distaine for democratic pricipals.

    James Hare
  85. Shawn Bull from Canada writes: Why does a number of people assume that if you are pro-life that it is religious driven? Is it possible that some people view a 'breathing form with a heart beat' as living and thus abortion is the romoval of this child's life?

    That appears to be more of a human response than religion driven.
  86. Andre Carrel from salmo, Canada writes: The real story here, the one citizens on all sides of the abortion question should be truly concerned about, is the story about the government issuing so-called 'talking points' to party members. When a Member of Parliament receives instructions on what to say by the presidium of his political party, that is when democracy becomes lobodomized. When Members of Parliament become 'low power relay transmitters' of the party line, it really does not matter anymore how free and fair their election has been.
  87. Paul F. from Toronto, Canada writes: This discussion is a little bizarre.

    First fact, the Order of Canada has plenty of controversial people. Conrad Black, convicted criminal, for example has one. Does the archbishop believe defrauding thousands of stockholders 'debases' the Order of Canada too? Don't recall the archbishop demanding that Black gives his up.

    Second, abortion is legal in this country. It is legal because of the fight he waged. There is little dispute of this. So he struggled to get something legalized that he believed in. And most Canadians support this. Just ask Harper if he is running on this issue in the next election. Didn't think so.

    Third, on the deserving thing. Hey, if they can make Kim Cambell an OFFICER of the Order, they can make Morgentaler a MEMBER. What is Kim Cambell's major achievement, aside from overseeing the destruction of a major political party?

    I think the 'pro-lifers' need to give this one a rest. Makes them look very petty and foolish.
  88. jenny g from Ottawa, Canada writes: Congratulations to Dr. Morgentaler. After a long and difficult life, a recognition of the immense contribution he's made through his strength of convictions. Thank you for making sure I have a choice, as a human being, over what happens in my body.

    I still find it strange that people don't realize that women always have wanted and had abortions. This isn't a new phenomenon. It's just that previous to abortions being 'legal', a woman had to resort to dangerous means in order to not carry a child that may have been forced upon her or whatever the reason. Previous to this, the abortion may have resulted in her never being able to have children, or dying in the process. It is this belief that women should not have to die or become barren to avoid having to undertake a relatively risky natural process that resulted in the challenge to the access of safe medical procedures to end pregnancies. People also have such short memories, they forget that pregnancy and childbirth were the number one killers of women prior to the 1900s.

    No one should judge the women who have to make that choice.
  89. Jorly fuster from Canada writes: Religion doesn't cause hate. It's all the over zealous whackos that can't accept anything but their own point of view that causes violence. Personally, I don't care what you do.
  90. Rob Bairos from Toronto, Canada writes: K M from Kitchener, Canada writes: '..Life cannot be devalued without loss to our society. Women's rights should be balanced with the rights of those unable to speak.'

    Or hear, or see, or feel or even have a conscious thought. Just to play devils advocate a cow has much greater a capacity to ration, feel, love, hate than a tiny collection of cells (the early stage of pregnancy).

    Just trying to flesh out our definitions and limits on both sides..
  91. JA M from Our Town, Canada writes: 'This isn't a pack of mid-30s yuppies using the service as contraception. It's mostly a bunch of scared teenage kids who got in way over their heads and are now paying for it, with often no one to help them but Mom and Dr. M.'

    Gee maybe mom and Dr M should consider prevention as being nine-tenths of the cure.
  92. sonny l from toronto, Canada writes: Congratulations HM. Some would prefer we stay in the dark ages and others push forward against the tide.

    They bombed up his clinic, do you people really want to support that? If you do, you might be too far gone I think.
  93. Honesty is the best Policy from Canada writes: Babbleon ! from Sarnia, Canada writes: There is 100 awards given each year and there is more than 4000 on the list.
    Hey Bobby Clark the hockey player has one.
    These are handed out a dime a dozen you should see some of the names on the list.
    =============================================
    Don't see your name.
  94. Harper-approved lies are scripted talking points from Canada writes: Congratulations to Dr. Morgentaler. Unlike those who call themselves 'pro-life,' he helps people who are actually alive to stay alive. He has risked his neck in the face of fanatical opposition to help women and people in need.

    He has brought honour and prestige to the Order of Canada. Bravo!
  95. Jorly fuster from Canada writes: Hector 3339 wrote to Jorly: '
    volunteer yourself to take in all the unwanted babies. Or tell society that there's no reason why a couple that is gay and just as loving and wanting of a child as a straight one can't have a baby.'

    I'm not even sure what your talking about dude but I'll take in babies as long as I don't have to change poopy diapers. Fair enough.
  96. Shawn Bull from Canada writes: 20 million unsafe illegal and 26 million legal abortions are performed each year according to the World Health Organization.

    46 worldwide abortions a year? I had no idea there were that many (Canada only has 30 million people). This is depressing.

    Mom, thank you for not getting an abortion when you were pregnant with me (because when I was in your belly I wasn't real).
  97. Whot Thefuck from Quito, Canada writes: Dr. Morgentaler is a true hero. A genuine asset to the country. This is a proud day.
  98. Janet M from Kingston, Canada writes: There is no doubt that this appointment is controversial. At the time when Morgentaler was most notable on the Canadian landscape...about thirty to thirty five years ago...things were different for women. Contraception was not as varied and certainly not as reliable as today and there was significant failure rate even in those who were using it. There were people who were using what they had...it failed and they wondered...what do I do now? Again, I really can see both stances here...pro and con to this apointment. Somehow, try as I might however, I do not judge Art Hanger as someone who would have the reality base to understand this.
  99. Shawn Bull from Canada writes: The comments are getting nasty and personal now. Thanks for the abortion debate while it lasted. Good bye.
  100. Billy Bee from Canada writes: Hairy Wrangellian from Saltspring Island, Canada writes: 'I'm sure the selection committee knew there would be backlash...'

    I bet they did.

    I want to see what that control-freak Harper does about this. This goes completely his faith, his party and many of his right-wing voters.

    I expect he'll recind the award to HM, blame the Liberals and then deny the whole thing.
  101. GK Cheese from Toronto, Canada writes: The Rev. Jeremiah Wright from Canada writes: Rick Sieb from Edmonton, Canada writes: 'Didn't Morgentaler spend time in jail. I wouldn't think they would give the Order of Canada to someone who had been in jail. Someone shouldn't be rewarded for breaking the law.' >>> This comment takes ignorance one step too far. Rosa Parks, Martin Luther King, Voltaire, Copernicus, Galileo, Socrates, even John McCain -- all these people spent time behind bars because they stood on principle.

    Correction. Actually Copernicus never spent any time in jail for his theory. He was always highly regarded throughout his life. The Church didn't take much notice of his theory until at least 6o years after his death. He maintained it as a theory rather than a fact, and his belief systen did not contradict the 'Great Chain of Being' as Gallileo did. That is, man still occupied a lowly place in the universe. Copernicus was a theologian. Incidently the heliocentric theory could not be proven as fact until a couple of centuries later.
  102. D P from Canada writes: Thank you, whoever, for finally for recognizing this great man as one who has endeavored, even when in personal peril, to assure that my freedom of choice, as a Canadian woman, is honored and upheld. My only question is this: What took so long for this award to bestowed on the great Dr?
  103. Paul F. from Toronto, Canada writes: Kitty Burgers from Hamilton, Canada writes: I'd like to know: just who are these people Dr. Morgentaler refers to as the 'Catholic Right'?

    ---

    Many Catholics don't agree with the Church's position on this one. The fact the archbishop came out on this is a little odd. When Bush was here, did the archbishop denounce his record of supporting the death penalty in the US? Are we selectively 'pro-life'?
  104. L Pratt from Canada writes: CHP My vote from Whoville, Canada 'To put abortion under the guise of 'women's rights' is as much of a stretch as anything.'

    WTF, are you for real? As soon as abortions are performed for men we'll stop saying they are a 'woman's right' and we'll call them a 'human right' until then, there is no other way to describe an abortion than as a woman's right.

    Great choice, congratulations Dr. Morgentaler!
  105. CHP My vote from Whoville, Canada writes: Paul F. from Toronto, Canada writes: This discussion is a little bizarre.

    First fact, the Order of Canada has plenty of controversial people. Conrad Black, convicted criminal, for example has one.

    Paul, Conrad Black, at the time he was awarded the medal, was a hugely successful business man, internationally! He contributed money to the arts, etc... so no, he was NOT controversial! I daresay you'd have not batted an eyelash when his name was up.

    Second, abortion is legal in this country. that's also UNTRUE. There are NO abortion laws in this country, thus it's just not unlawful! That's right, it's not illegal, because there are no laws dealing with it.
  106. Ed Long from white Rock, Canada writes: Over 100,000 Canadian women per year have an abortion.

    Certainly Dr. Morgentaler was pivotal in this statistic.

    I don't know if this is a good thing.
  107. Babbleon ! from Sarnia, Canada writes: Honesty is the best Policy from Canada writes: Babbleon ! from Sarnia, Canada writes: There is 100 awards given each year and there is more than 4000 on the list.
    Hey Bobby Clark the hockey player has one.
    These are handed out a dime a dozen you should see some of the names on the list.
    =============================================
    Don't see your name.

    Silly person of course you won't find it under Babbleon.
  108. The Wight from Canada writes: JA M:

    'Gee maybe mom and Dr M should consider prevention as being nine-tenths of the cure.'

    And I think that's the mindset that ultimately results in the illogical RW stance. Morgenthaler DOES advocate birth control - heavily. Part of your parting 'gift' from the clinic is reams of birth control information.

    I think the RW are the only group alive who somehow think it possible that teens can make the right decision, 100% of the time, when it comes to reproduction and birth control. It is almost like they've never raised teens or been a teenager themselves. We don't expect them to be mature enough to drive until they are 14 with supervision and 16 on their own. They're not mature enough to drink until they are at least 18 and often older ... but we expect complete maturity and adherence from them when it comes to birth control. Even if 9 of 10 young women follow through on their parent's advice, that still leaves 1 in 10 that needs a Dr. Morgenthaler. Even that percentage, 90%, seems like a parenting dream world to me.
  109. verruckt verruckt from Canada writes: Howard Stern was right... men won the sexaul revolution! Women are now acting like men that we used to call 'pigs'! ... and now the implications of their behaviour has been downgraded to a wart of mole. It seem on a whole that the more educated and more 'knowledgable' we get the more we downgrade the value of human life and act like animals. Last I heard there had been about 40 million abortions in Canada and the US..... that doesn't sounds like progress to me it sounds like degrading a human life to a disposable item! We reap what we sow and we can see it in teenagers having a 1 in 10 change of an STD before they graduate, Aids killing millions around the world and all very easily preventable. If this man deserves the award then so would Josef Mengela for helping to solve the inconveniet gypsie, jew etc. problems in Germany. We are just starting to see the social and ecomoic impacts of our behaviour. So we start to spend billions on cures and rather than work on education and prevention and boys and girls not treating each other like stress toys to squeeze. Yep... right is wrong and wrong is right in this culture, where we seem to have more sympathy for the criminal than the victim and give the murder awards.....
  110. Ed Long from white Rock, Canada writes: My partner is a former mid-wife and registered nurse from the UK.

    She has been present for abortions, and many more births.

    She has counselled women who have had abortions.

    This is the only subject that breaks her reserve, she is vehemently anti-abortion as a means of birth control or for lifestyle reasons.

    I really feel this is a womens' issue and I do wish a woman active in womens' issues had been chosen.
  111. don cherry from toronto, writes: Congratulations to Dr. Henry Morgentaler for his vision, courage, and hard work.
  112. Babbleon ! from Sarnia, Canada writes: Honesty is the best Policy, you know maybe I should look they might of gave me one and I don't know about it.

  113. Billy Bee from Canada writes: What's next? Do the pro-lifers want to ban condoms too? Think about all those poor little sperm that are dying pointless deaths!!!

    Oh wait, I forgot! We have GWB trying to do just that! And Stephen Harper said: 'America, and particularly your conservative movement, is a light and an inspiration to people in this country and across the world.'

    Don't forget Harper has promised not to raise pro-life or pro-family legislation (and we all know how good his promises are), but he has promised to allow such legislation to be introduced by others and to permit free votes.

    Give Harper a majority and who knows what this clown will do to this country - and women's rights!
  114. Paul F. from Toronto, Canada writes: JA M from Our Town, Canada writes: 'This isn't a pack of mid-30s yuppies using the service as contraception. It's mostly a bunch of scared teenage kids who got in way over their heads and are now paying for it, with often no one to help them but Mom and Dr. M.'

    Gee maybe mom and Dr M should consider prevention as being nine-tenths of the cure.

    ----

    That would involved teaching sex education in schools, something the Catholic Church has opposed for the longest time. Not to mention learning how to use a condom, another 'sin' in the eyes of the Church.

    Besides, you know what? There are things called accidents, errors in judgement, etc. Canadians in their majority believe a woman should not be compelled to carry a fetus to term if she choses not to. Thanks to Morgetaler battles over the years, they don't have to.

    For a religion that excludes all women from decision making bodies, we are supposed to hear how the Order of Canada is 'debased'?!?
  115. B W from Canada writes: did verruckt verruckt really compare Dr. Morgantaler's work to the work of Josef Mengele?....wow.

    I don't agree with abortions, but I acknowledge that whether they're legal or not, there are and will be woman who seek out this service. I don't see Morgantaler's legacy being so much about women's right to choose - women were already choosing to have abortions. Morgantaler's legacy was about providing a venue where women could choose more safely. Prior to Morgantaler, women had to turn to the questionable pract