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Del Biaggio ducked due diligence: report

TIM WHARNSBY

From Friday's Globe and Mail

Latest comment posted at 7:57 PM EDT 19/07/08

NHL commissioner Gary Bettman has been accused of circumventing the league's customary background check ...Read the full article

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  1. tim smith from Canada writes: "He was hired to grow the game in the United States and give us cost certainty," the governor said."

    Right, which is why Canadian hockey fans hate him: he is openly biased towards keeping teams in the U.S., even at the expense of Canadian cities that could support them.

    "I know the doomsday people in Toronto like to point out the fact that under his watch they lost franchises in Quebec City and Winnipeg. The truth is, though, that when the owners of these two teams put their franchises up for sale, no Canadian owners stepped up, and even the great Montreal Canadiens were purchased by an American owner."

    Ok, except you said that everyone knows he is biased towards spreading hockey in the United States, so if you live in Canada....

    Not to mention that when a Canadian investor stepped in with a generous offer to buy a struggling American team, you totally brick-walled him because apparently he didn't go to the right country club. Fans aren't coming and teams are losing money, but hey, there's MORE of them!
  2. Mariposa Belle from Leacockland, Canada writes: Tim smith - very good post. I was not surprised at the anonymous governor's statement regaring Montreal. Gillette saw an underutilized resorce and decided he could make money in Montreal. His adventure in England did not fare as well, as he had to bring in a partner that did not share his vision.

    Agree entirely with your view regarding Balsillie and Nashville becoming the new Hamilton Tigers. Although Mike M in another hockey post pointed out that Nashville is a viable hockey town, I would suggest that Hamilton (or K-W) is a viable and profitable hockey town.

    My suggestion is to get rid of Bettman and close the NY office. Appoint Mariposa Belle as both Commissioner and office location - common sense will return to the league and those who disagree will be tossed overboard (we are usually stuck on a sandbar, so extreme action is not fatal).
  3. Scot Loucks from Pickering, Canada writes: Come on guys... I have lectured you on this before.

    Due to the Canadian dollar and the comeback in Canada after the strike..... 6 teams are generating all the new revenue.

    Lets take two losing American teams.... put one in Winnipeg and the other in Hamilton. (Neither arena is ready for prime time btw.... but a new one just outside of KW would be built pretty quick).

    Those teams would be 100 percent sold out... people would buy their sweaters... their hats... etc etc.

    The salary cap would go up.... as would the minimum. This is where Bettman and his cost certainty screwed up... and it is also why you won't see more Canadian teams for a while.

    As of today.. LAK are 12.4m below cap minimum. Atlanta is 3.5m below and Phoenix is 2.4m below.

    There are no good UFA's out there for them to buy..... So they must trade to meet the minimum.

    Philadelphia, Chicago, Washington, Calgary and Anaheim are all over the cap... they have to get rid of assets.

    Put another team or two in Canada and it all blows up...... Bettman is not anti Canadian... he is trying to save the league.

    Cheers
  4. robert harris from Canada writes: The other shoe about to drop; Broadcom and Samueli. Looks like Bettman is creating his own little Mafia of investors with big money acquired under dubious circumstances.
  5. Mariposa Belle from Leacockland, Canada writes: Scot - what is the penalty for a team under the minimum? It certainly isn't relegation to the 'A'.

    If any team is to move to Canada it will be Atlanta. It's been done before and they had Boom-Boom and Dan Bouchard as entertainment - this current team pales beside those two.

    The problem with Bettman's vision was that he was hired to encourage the sport in non-traditional markets. That has been done and there are some successes but a number of failures.

    Perhaps it is time to retrench and hold to the gains while looking at easier objectives to take (love WWI allusions).

    Long Way from Tipperary...
  6. Scot Loucks from Pickering, Canada writes: Mariposa...

    My guess is that Bettman has made some promises south of the border.... he is a slimy little.... whatever.

    I don't want to take an anti Canadian tact here... but there was an article a few months ago about California players playing the WHL. It also mentioned the new arenas and interest in Dallas, Carolina and Tampa..... Hockey is growing in the states... slowly... but growing.

    Bettman knows he can grow the market by expanding back into Canada... he isn't stupid.... but to do it now would be at the expense of franchises that the NHL has invested in south of the border.

    He isn't going to do it.

    Quebec city needs a new arena.... they are a prime choice. Both Hamilton and Winnipeg have small market rinks... they have to upgrade. Winnipeg is probably the easiest.

    Balsille needs to build his rink outside of KW..... build it... and then they will come.

    Cheers
  7. Sandy T. from Canada writes:

    Mariposa Belle from Leacockland, Canada writes:

    "If any team is to move to Canada it will be Atlanta. It's been done before and they had Boom-Boom and Dan Bouchard as entertainment - this current team pales beside those two."

    Maybe, but... it does have Ilya - worth the price of a ticket all by his little old self on most nights, and on some nights can be the best player in the league. If they burned those gawdawful Thrasher unis, this edition would look good in S. Ont.
  8. Scot Loucks from Pickering, Canada writes: Sandy T;

    Too right. I saw Kovalchuk play twice last year. (live) his speed is amazing.

    If nothing else ... Atlanta has the best new coach (John Anderson) in the league next year.

    Cheers
  9. Gary Dare from Portland, Oregon, Canada, writes: Tim Smith writes, "Ok, except you said that everyone knows he is biased towards spreading hockey in the United States, so if you live in Canada...." Agreed but also note that he had, in general, a policy opposing relocation, period, unless it was by the existing owner (Norm Green, Pete Karmanos). Paul Allen was rebuffed twice in trying to get the Pittsburgh Penguins, and then the Phoenix Coyotes, for Portland, Oregon.
  10. Allan Cup Pugh from SSM,ON, Canada writes: Gary Bettman must go.
    When fans boo him, on EVERY public occassion, he says he loves their 'passion'.
    Fans don't like him or trust him.
    Could it be possible that Bettman was sent to damage the NHL,somehow? Or at least stall its progress by working on the inside to impede it?
    Is he the utimate mole?
  11. Dave The Rave from Ottawa, Canada writes: Some comments here allude to Bettmann's supposed stonewalling of Canadian investors who want to buy US-based teams. Which investors? Balsillie is the only one that seems to have presented himself, and from all reports, he apparently did not comply with the league's requirements. As for Canadian fans 'hating' Bettmann...what is the proof? Are there polls that have been taken by reputable firms on the subject? There are indeed franchises that are troubled, and team (company) principals with financial problems. Mr. Del Biaggio is one of many so-called high flyers whose empire was built on shaky ground, but who managed to fool his partners (who may well have let themselves be fooled). These situations are not limited to professional hockey, as the current economic climate in North America demonstrates. When financial institutions such as Bear Stearns, CIBC and UBS have more than their share of problems, and bankruptcies and foreclosures are soaring, the peccadilloes of hockey teams are just that. Regarding Canadian teams, a recent article in the Edmonton Journal by David Staples points out their problems were exacerbated when the Canadian dollar reached its low of 61.73 cents USD in 2002, while it traded under 70 cents from 1996 to 2003. This was, according to the author, one of the major reasons teams in Quebec and Winnipeg were obliged to relocate. Staples further reminds us Bettman engineered a financial assistance plan for Canadian teams, despite that it did not please some US owners. In the absence of facts, the notion that somehow there is a conspiracy against Canada by the NHL Board of Governors seems more like media-generated fear mongering to get hockey fans all bent out of shape. And that appears to have succeeded.
  12. sam themacman from Waterloo, Canada writes: Wow... the arrogance of ownership... the fans of Winnipeg and Quebec City sure got the shaft, and from their own ownership. The Nordiques were sold down the river by a Quebecer which only states the obvious, it was nothing about the fan base but about the money. Both the Jets and Nordiques were sold for the cash cow it would bring the ownership. The same thing should have happened to the Pens and the Preds. They should have been sold and relocated, to locations in Canada. The attendance in Quebec City and in Winnipeg is still huge in comparison to the expansion cities or relocation cities in the US. No offense to Bettman, but 'grow the game in the US'? By giving franchises to cities that have no winter climate. That makes a lot of sense, oops, I mean, cents! Give me a break. Hockey will always remain a regional game, and it's best fan best is where there is actually winter snow! One of the cardinal rules of expansion should be that you actually have winter weather! Shut down the teams that are in the south and in the west. Get them to cities that have snow. Mater of fact, the NHL should reduce the amount of teams by at least six or eight, and they should all be warm weather cities that lose their teams. I can't believe this. Another 15 years of Bettman? Financial certainty and security? Really? It has taken two seasons past the lockout, and we are back where we started, and it is all the fault of the owners. Unbelievable. Salaries are going through the roof. You know things are bad, when teams like the Sabres are nothing more than a farm team for developing talent. Look at all the key players they have lost over the last two seasons. They are a mediocre team and will remain so. They have lost too much talent and cannot replace it. So much for the lockout helping teams. The Sabres suck and will suck even more this year. The Leafs are a joke and will remain a joke. They just do not have the management team, or the scouts.
  13. Joel S from Canada writes: If Boots (I had a cat named Bootsie once) can scam banks out of multi-millions it's not a stretch that he could do it to a desperate 2nd tier sports operation like the NHL.

    The thing that continually bugs me is the un-named source. He gets to make jerky comments about Canadians with impunity because nobody knows who he is. He gets his ego stroked, gets to "vent his spleen" by seeing his words in print but doesn't ever have to defend himself.

    I'm not necessarily disagreeing with the tone of the remarks but for crying out loud, grow a pair and allow/encourage the reporter to use your name.
  14. andy c from Canada writes: as much as i dont like bettman it pains me to say i'd take the NHL's word over a guy who's being sued and investigated by the FBI for fraud.
  15. Joe Dirt from Canada writes: Under the job description for NHL Governor does it say "Gary Bettman apologist"?
  16. David P from vancouvercalgary, Canada writes: I worked for the Jets back in the day and Bettman loathed coming to the city for any reason...as soon as it looked like there was going to be funding committments to get a new rink and local people were stepping up to purchase enough of the team to keep it in the Peg, Bettman changed some rules (some familiar Mr. Balsille?) and got the Jets out of Winnipeg as fast as he could...Barry Shenkaro (sp) had very little interest in keeping the team there - he saw the $86Mil payday and couldn't get his hands on the cash fast enough...

    Agreed Winnipeg is a small market and might not be the best place for a team to gather gobs of cash every year, bu they'd pack the new barn...the MTS centre is a hell of a lot better to watch a game in than the sterile Saddledome...

    I'd love to see a team back in Winnipeg, I'd like to see Balsille buy a team, move them to KW and have them win the cup before TO does and I'd like to see Bettman and Colin Campbell canned if for no other reason than I don't like them...
  17. Cruthin Clan from Canada writes: Start a Canadian league. If you get the right business people, and money, involved they can lock up the TV here. If Bettman sues for monopoly just cite the fact that the USFL only won $1 from the NFL for the same thing.
  18. Neil No more last name from Mississauga, Canada writes: I'd love to know who that "govenor" was they were quoting. I'd slap him in the face for that slap in the Habs face. Economically it was a whole other world when Winnipeg and Quebec left.

    Fast Foward to today - you have a Canadian owner with billions, who wants to put a second hockey team in the 5th largest market in N.America and the Largest hockey market in the world.

    Forget growing the game in the states, it's not working. The money isn't there. It's here in Canada, with owners who are ready willing and have the money.

    But no.

    Btch about the Toronto media all you want, unnamed governor, McCowan and other's are going to (hopefully) run Bettman out of the league one day.

    Keep pushing Toronto Media
  19. Neil No more last name from Mississauga, Canada writes: Bob McCowan and Brunt and others have been going at this hard on Prime Time sports. Prime time has had a few owners from around the league on the show to discuss Del Biaggio.
    Most owners plead ignorance and state they and Bettman were dooped. I think it's bull sht.

    Kris King from the Flames went as far as saying, absolutley nothing and played the company line to a T. The Canadian owners realize they are supporting the league right now, but they also don't forget when the big market teams in the U.S. were saving their bacon. See 2 seasons ago.

    it's a mess for sure - The Ducks owners are in trouble, Tampa Bay's owners are more WWE than NHL, Melnyk has his "banking" problems, the Leafs - my Lord the Leafs, Balsilie with tonnes of dough is shut out in favour of a crook called "Boots", no one's watching hockey in over half of the American markets, they rely on Gate revenue but teams in the U.S. are virtually (sometimes literally) giving tickets away, no ESPN.

    All of this is just degrading the NHL into Bush league status.
  20. Neil No more last name from Mississauga, Canada writes: Scot and Dave the Rave - At what point do you (I mean the NHL owners) realize that the plan isn't working? Regardless of the economy in N.America, hockey has not worked in Atlanta,Nashville and the usual suspects.

    I know the potential revenues are greater if the game ever does take off ACROSS the U.S., but at what point does the NHL realize it ain't gonna happen? And Realize they're better off maximizing there revenues in markets where Hockey does Work? You gotta know when to fold 'em, know when to walk away.

    The NHL should be in Sweden before Tennesse. The NBA and NFL are en route to beating the NHL to Europe, despite hockey's popularity in Europe 50 years prior to american Football and Basketball's.

    As for hockey slowly gaining ground in Texas and L.A. - fine, keep a couple franchises there if it works. If there's not another Wayne Gretzky in LA in the next 10 years, expect the sports popularity to wane (pun). Robbie Earl played hockey as a kid becuase he grew up watching the Great one. You think the next generation is inspired by Jason LaBarbera and Patrick O'Sullivan?
  21. Neil No more last name from Mississauga, Canada writes: I hope LA can build up a dynasty and keep fans interested. I'd hate to see more Tampa Bay theatrics across the league. Expect Dallas and SJ to see numbers drop (attendance, youth enrollment) as well if those teams don't remain competitive.

    It's simple - when it "wasn't working" in Quebec and Winnipeg, those teams were ushered out with vigour into the hands of willing Americans.
    When it "isn't working" in the U.S. the willing Canadian is shut out. That's a load of crap, no?

    Know what else is a load of crap? Willing to overlook/trust someone with a name like "Boots"/embarrass your league just to keep teams in non-traditional market(s).
  22. slapdash dapoint from trawna, Canada writes: ""Rightly or wrongly, the league has grown from 21 to 30 teams ...""

    'yeah, we know there's a good chance we messed up, but uh, yeah, we're just gonna keep plug'n away... if we changed our plans now, that'd be like admitting we were wrong, kinda like what i just said, but uh, in a more concrete sort of way, you know?'

    funny, the cup was originally meant for canada's top amatuer team... nice to see that progress has brought us here, where canada is all but shut out from having teams.

    bettman, if you really want to grow the game in the states, perhaps you should cap the amount of canadian players in the league, and set a min # of americans, change periods to innings (or change them to 4 15 minute quarters), 3 points for goals from outside the blue line, can the 'ice hockey' crap and just call it american hockey, and call the refs umpires...?
  23. Ian m from new york, United States writes: The NHL the way it should be - pull out of the Southeast entirely, get rid of Columbus, Phoenix and new jersey (no room for three teams in NY)

    Move Tampa to Quebec
    Move Phoenix to Winnipeg
    Move Nashville to Hamilton

    New Divisions:

    Northeast: Boston, Ottawa, NYR, NYI, Quebec, Montreal
    Central: Toronto, Detroit, Buffalo, Pittsburgh, Philly, Hamilton
    Northwest: Winnipeg, calgary, Edmonton, Vancouver, Minnesota, Chicago
    Southwest: Dallas, San Jose, St. Louis, Colorado, Anaheim, LA

    Chicago gets the shaft a bit.

    Also - send Rick Nash and Alex Ovechkin to the Montreal Canadiens
  24. Verona Raven from United States writes: You think Canadians fans hate him? Ask anyone in Hartford what they think of that twirp.
  25. SY GIL from TO, Canada writes: Southwestern Ontario deserves, wants and can support another NHL team to ensure the TML don't perpetuate their dismal records of not even getting close to the Cup. Move some of those dead weighs in hockey mad cities like Miami, Phoenix and Atlanta. From the fans' perspective, it's ok to see fewer teams. That will ensure there aren't so many fringe players in the NHL such that fans have to watch neutral traps or the left wing lock, etc. which KILLS the game.
  26. Dave The Rave from Ottawa, Canada writes: In the flurry of opinions on the subject of franchise viability, what is forgotten is that the ownership of a professional sports franchise is part of an incredibly complex web of real estate, banking, legal, public funding and revenue sharing deals, all involving what is hundreds of millions (even billions) of dollars, big fat commissions, incentives, finders' fees and the like, and the lining of pockets, all of whose details are never made public. (Again, this is explored in Staples' thought-provoking Edmonton Journal piece.) Simply stated, the NHL is not accountable to the public, and never has been. We as fans may have our druthers, but that is of little consequence to--dare I say it--ANY owner. Is Bettman a good and competent commissioner? Who can pass that judgement? Part of his mandate is to facilitate an economic framework which stimulates the value, or more precisely, the acquisition, or sale price, of a franchise. That has certainly taken place since he has assumed the post. If Jim Balsillie waves a bag of dubloons in his face, so what? Bettman is not beholden to Jimbo, nor any other suitor. Are there teams in geographies that seem ridiculous to some fans? Clearly. But hockey is a business, and the 'business rules' rule. Spend time in a VIP box/suite and you'll see for yourself: the game is secondary to 'the deal'. The veneer of 'we care about the fan' is an invention of highly paid propaganda merchants. The owners want to create 'entertainment' that motivates people to spend their money, pure and simple. Sport, as such, has very little to do with it. Meanwhile, fans, encouraged by journos, get all worked up over things like 'my team rocks, your team sucks', 'championship spirit', 'grit' and all that hogwash, flinging insults at players (who are just doing a job) and each other (as seen on this and other forums); all while the owners count their cash. The reality is stark: if we enjoy hockey as a game, it can be fun, but that's all we can expect.
  27. Scot Loucks from Pickering, Canada writes: Great post Dave

    Cheers
  28. Hap Stokes from Canada writes: How can some many overlook the OBVIOUS?

    You want a RICH American city huh?
    You want a BIG market do ya?
    You want the rink FILLED every game heey?
    You want to GROW the game huh?

    Then what in hell is wrong with SEATTLE?
    That's Seattle Washington (on the Pacific).

    Only thing wrong is instead of non-traditional Seattle is a hockey town.
    Then it is EZ to spread to another hockey city near-by PORTLAND OR

    Achtung--DO NOT expand to Las Vegas--LV is a losing proposition.

    Forget it the Easteners run the g/d league--What's the stupid use?
    They don't understand the SIMPLE things and can't read a map either
    Sure as hell those dum-dums are going to put a LOSER in Vegas!
  29. Verona Raven from United States writes: The obvious is that Seattle is one of the most apathetic sports towns in the USA next to Atlanta. The Supersonics will probably be leaving soon...

    There is a good reason why the NHL stays out of the Northwest. Despite the money that is clearly there...

    My relocation teams

    Atlanta
    Carolina
    Nashville
    Columbus (Ohio likes college hockey...)
    I'd include the Devils and Islanders too...but they will stay because of their TV deals...the ONLY reason why they are still around.
  30. Neil No more last name from Mississauga, Canada writes: Dave the Rave - you forgot one thing - winning means more money.

    Your stark assessment of the politics of ownership in the NHL amounts to, in my opinion:
    The behind the scenes business of the NHL is too complex to understand. Just enjoy the game and don't ask questions.

    It is quite stark and frankly it is a business like any other. However, there is no need to accept the status quo. Your assessment is too mundane for my liking, but I'll refrain from hurling insults
  31. Scot Loucks from Pickering, Canada writes: The worst attendance in the league....

    25 Florida 41 632,881

    26 Boston 41 630,750

    27 Nashville 41 611,328

    28 Columbus 41 607,757

    29 Phoenix 41 607,638

    30 NY Islanders 41 559,247

    http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/attendance?year=2008

    Cheers
  32. Wes Stanton from Nashville, United States writes: I look at the Supersonics move and am glad we fought to keep it around here for a little longer. I think one thing that hurt Nashville with hockey is we didnt get an established franchise........like the Titans from Houston. People around here jump on a winning bandwagon fast and are not patient for success. I'm sure if the Titans didnt go to a playoff game the first 6 years (like the Predators), coaches would have been fired and a constant turnover of players would have ensued. They go to the Super Bowl their first year with the new stadium and the name Titans..........and bam!.....it is an NFL town. It sucks sometimes listening to all of the ownership crap, but you get used to it after awhile. We're still here, so I'm going to enjoy it. The Predators are a fine organization and I can understand why someone would want to buy them. Wish the Leafs were making the trip down here this year. Go Preds!
  33. Gary Dare from Portland, Oregon, Canada, writes: Hap Stokes writes, "Only thing wrong is instead of non-traditional Seattle is a hockey town.
    Then it is EZ to spread to another hockey city near-by PORTLAND OR" We have touched on reasons why this won't work, in a couple of previous discussions already. Things have not changed in the last month or two.

    The problem with both cities is arena access. Key Arena in Seattle was purposefully built to NOT house a NHL franchise. Until the NBA returns to the Emerald City and a new arena is (likely) built in Bellevue, WA then there is no place to put a NHL team.

    Paul Allen tried the buy-and-relocate approach twice for Portland, Oregon (Penguins, Coyotes) and was fended off by Bettman, both times. With the dot-com crash of 2001 and rebuilding the Trailblazers, he's in no position to buy a NHL team and place it in the Rose Garden to compete for ticket sales in the rainy season.
  34. Gary Dare from Portland, Oregon, Canada, writes: Verona Raven writes, "The obvious is that Seattle is one of the most apathetic sports towns in the USA next to Atlanta. The Supersonics will probably be leaving soon..." The Supersonics relocation was approved two weeks ago.

    The Sonics had good attendance, I don't know why you would call Seattle apathetic since they did well, along with the Seahawks and Mariners. While citizens voted in a referendum to ban corporate welfare to pro sports franchises, that should be seen as good news. Too many failing US-based NHL teams are draining the budgets of state and local governments. Even the Predators plot acknowledged bleeding Nashville tax dollars that could have gone to schools, police and fire service.

    The only bizarre part of the Sonics story was that people were shocked that the team was moved after selling it to a consortium that was specifically chartered to buy and relocate a team to OKC.
  35. Mike M from GTA, Canada writes: Scot, just for comparison with some of your target cities ...

    First, putting things in terms of average attendance:

    26. Boston - 15,384
    27. Nashville - 14,910
    28. Columbus - 14,823
    29. Phoenix - 14,820
    30. Isle - 13,640

    Now, let's jump back to 1993-94 (the 2nd last year of both Winnipeg and Quebec City - I'm ignoring the last year as Quebec's attendance went way down, which was probably due to their impending departure) ...

    Quebec City - 14,614 in an arena with 15,750 capacity
    Winnipeg - 13,294 in an arena with 15,565 capacity

    Winnipeg's population and economy have grown since then, but I'm not sure if it's grown enough since that time to expect any significant difference. In Quebec, Boucher said the city wouldn't do what was necessary to upgrade things (i.e. arena) to begin the pursuit of an NHL team. I haven't heard anything from Labeaume to indicate anything has changed.

    The only other city that has been mentioned in this section is Hamilton and they already have a team - the Buffalo Sabres. If a team goes up in the K-W or Hamilton region, it means the end of that team and really no difference to fans in the area - maybe a 30-minute shorter trip, but no place at all similar to the Anchor Bar (damn Hamilton sucks when it can't even compete with Buffalo on food).
  36. The Pen Is Mightier from Canada writes: I think that Winnipeg, Quebec and Hamilton should get another shot at having an NHL team. Winnipeg can take Phoenix (would be pretty sweet to have Gretzky as the coach and of course is a legend up in Canada), Hamilton can take Buffalo (makes sense due to same fan base), and Quebec and take whatever struggling team they wish. I still think that a team could possibly work in Saskatchewan too (just saying). We need to get rid of Bettman if this is ever to happen though. I really just want my hockey back in my hometown. Don`t want to have to travel hours away just to see a game anymore.
  37. Greg Naydiuk from United States writes: Hilarious post by "Slapdash DaPoint" - my side still hurts!

    Yes, and once we've "grown the game in the US".....next up.....

    "grow the sport of beach volleyball in Greenland"

    Film at 11!
  38. Scot Loucks from Pickering, Canada writes: Mike M from GTA;

    The arena in Quebec city isn't suitable any more for an NHL team. They would need a new one.

    Copps would require serious upgrades and already has a tenant in the Bulldogs.... I'd like to see a new one on the land Balsille bought in Cambridge.... which is outside the territory of both Buffalo and Toronto.

    Winnipeg has the newest arena but is a little small by NHL standards with a capacity of 15,015..... although is has suites for approx. 1100 seats. If they sold out every game their attendance would be 25th in the league.... just behind Anaheim.

    Bottom line is that while the support is their for teams in all three places the infrastructure is not.... without that infrastructure.... a drop in the Canadian dollar would put both Winnipeg and Quebec city back into hurting status.

    Cheers
  39. Hap Stokes from Canada writes: Scot I've lived in Boston
    If somebody says that's a "Poor Hockey Town" I say Bull-Shiite!
    If there are troubles it ain't with those nutty fans in Boston it has to be with SOMETHING ELSE.

    Now Verona, once lived in Seattle too, albeit only 3 months but I tell you that is a pure HOCKEY TOWN with a long history in the game. And so is Portland and yes once lived in Eugene a little over 1.5 hour south of there and Portland is a VERY BIG hockey town too.

    Verona Raven from United States writes: The obvious is that Seattle is one of the most apathetic sports towns in the USA next to Atlanta. The Supersonics will probably be leaving soon.

    Not positive what the Sonics dispute is over, but from what have been told seems remarkable similar to the long ago LA Rams dispute.
    Seemingly OWNERS wanting public funds and not getting the moola.

    Just to show you I've been around Verona was in LA too during that uproar over the Rams.--Talk about OWNERSHIP the LA Rams ex-owners then, make the present day Leafs problems seem 'trivial' in comparison.

    The former elderly Rams owner died leaving the LA Rams to his young 7 times married beautiful Widow. After the funeral the young Widow soon met a 4 times married trumpet player and they made music together and the Wedding Bells rang out ELEVEN more times.

    The new Him/Her LA Rams owners were soon near bankruptcy and asking for LA tax funds, which like Seattle (with the Sonics); were turned DOWN flat.-- So Verona, we have today The St Louis Rams.
    And tomorrow we'll have the new (Fill-in Blank) Supersonics too.

    That doesn't mean LA isn't a good Football Town--Nor does it mean
    Seattle is a poor Basketball Town either.
    And Boston is a damn great Hockey Town too.
    And so would Seattle be if it had an NHL team.

    Mr Bettman, don't sell any team to a very rich Trumpet player with a bleached blond very married wife.
  40. Mike M from GTA, Canada writes: Scot - what I'm wondering is why you think it's a guarantee that Quebec and Winnipeg would sell out there teams and why you think the support is already in place. Winnipeg was hardly drawing 85% at the Winnipeg Arena that doesn't have enough capacity for a modern NHL team. Quebec was just breaking 90% at a similar capacity arena. Why is it a given that the support is already in place in these cities?
  41. Scot Loucks from Pickering, Canada writes: Hap .... didn't mean to suggest that Boston wasn't a hockey town.. just quoting numbers. (Big Bobby Orr fan here). Their numbers have been going up after too many mediocre years and championship baseball and football teams.... expecting big things from them in 08/09.

    Mike M; I have a couple brothers and a couple friends who have moved to Winnipeg in the last few years. I have done some work out there myself. The town is booming..... They could definitely support a team. Quebec city always had the support and has become richer as well IMHO..... their arena was old when the Nordiques played there though.

    btw .... my numbers above were wrong... i was looking at 2006 figures.... Winnipeg with 100 percent sell outs would fall behind Boston in their current arena.

    Back to Hap.... I agree Hap.. Seattle should have a team. It would be a perfect west coast divison.... LA, Anaheim, SJ, Phoenix, Seattle and Vancouver.

    Cheers
  42. The Pen Is Mightier from Canada writes: I`m sure Winnipeg would have no problem at all making room for extra seats.
  43. Neil No more last name from Canada writes: From what I see, the difference between Boots and Balsilie is this:

    Balsilie openly admittted he would move the team.

    Boots privately tried to entrench it in his contract.

    Balsilie was shunned because "he apparently did not comply with the league's requirements"

    Boots was allowed to duck aspects of the screening process.

    As Hap would say - load of "shiite"
  44. Gary Dare from Portland, Oregon, Canada, writes: Hap Stokes writes, "And tomorrow we'll have the new (Fill-in Blank) Supersonics too." Already done, the franchise goes to OKC but the Sonics name and logo stay with the city, available to the next NBA team that appears in Seattle. (Maybe the Grizzlies?) That's part of the settlement.

    On the public financing issue, Clay Bennett and his team played the charade by making an arena proposal in Renton, WA that would have required LOTS of public financing. The building required 60% public funds. New roads would be needed for all the new traffic to reach an abandoned Boeing field. And there are rumors that it is a brown field, which would have eventually scotched the project, cost millions to clean up (bringing in the Feds) and the delay causing an arena crisis that sends the Sonics out of town by the 2011 expiration of their Key Arena lease (which was settled as part of the team's departure).

    Nowadays, state, county and local government budgets are in no shape for pro sports socialist corporate welfare. Boots set up the Preds to be a fiscal sinkhole and Nashville city hall stepped right into it.
  45. Dave The Rave from Ottawa, eh, Canada writes: And now for some really hot news. A Swedish news organization reports Mats Sundin is ready to sign with Vancouver...IF he decides to return to the NHL.
    http://www.kuklaskorner.com/index.php/CandB/comments/reportifhereturnstothenhlsundinpicksthecanucks/

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