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Sundin rumours untrue

PAUL ATTFIELD

Globe and Mail Update

Latest comment posted at 2:28 PM EDT 20/07/08

Despite Swedish reports to the contrary, the Leaf captain has not yet agreed to join the Canucks ...Read the full article

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  1. Proud Canadian from Canada, Canada writes: When Mats decides on what he wants to do, I am sure he has David Shoalt's cell phone number, he will give Shoalts the first dib on the story.
  2. Jason Thorne from Vancouver, Canada writes: I hope he doesn't come to play here in Vancouver, $20 million for 2 years is too much in my opinion. Also, the Canucks don't look like a team that will do much this season.
  3. Captain Ontario from Canada writes: He'll likely be back in Toronto if he can get a 2 year deal for 15 mill.

    That's what he's waiting for.

    Sundin likes the city and like the dressing room.

    Or maybe the Rangers if Fletcher stupidly plays hardball.
  4. The Pen Is Mightier from Canada writes: Maybe Sundin will end up signing in Detroit for less money so he can have a chance to win the cup? LOL. If he signs in Toronto or Vancouver, he`ll never have a chance to win. Montreal would be one of the best choices if he wants to stay in Canada, maybe even Edmonton with all their young talent. 10 million per season is way too much for him at this age. I would say around 5 million would be more reasonable. He doesn`t deserve more money than Crosby, Thornton, Malkin, Hossa, Ovechkin, etc.
  5. Hap Stokes from Canada writes: TRAVEL TRAVEL TRAVEL.
    Guys in the Easter Conf players do not like the Western travel.
    Latest rumor here by those Vanc sports experts is about Sundin & travel

    One of the 'shortest trips' for the Canucks is to play the Oilers.
    That's just a tad farther than Detroit to Montreal.

    Or put another way--
    A short hop to Denver which is considered (near-by in the west)
    Is the same distance as from Toronto to Tampa Bay which eastern folks consider a VERY long way off.

    Eastern players have very serious troubles adjusting to those travel distances--Just ask Loungo and so will Sundin.
  6. Mike B from Canada writes: Why jump 1 sinking ship to join another taking on water?
  7. Popeye Dillon from North Vancouver, Canada writes: I'd rather see us stink and build for the future next year than waist money on a player past his shelf life.
  8. George S from Toronto, Canada writes: Sundin is a great player and deserves a legitimate shot at the cup- I don't think Vancouver would be a good choice for him.
  9. Liam Smith from Canada writes: The Pen Is Mightier from Canada writes: Maybe Sundin will end up signing in Detroit for less money so he can have a chance to win the cup? LOL. If he signs in Toronto or Vancouver, he`ll never have a chance to win. Montreal would be one of the best choices if he wants to stay in Canada, maybe even Edmonton with all their young talent. 10 million per season is way too much for him at this age. I would say around 5 million would be more reasonable. He doesn`t deserve more money than Crosby, Thornton, Malkin, Hossa, Ovechkin, etc.

    I actually disagree with a couple of your players. He does deserve more than Hossa or Thornton. He's still a serious asset to any team he plays on and performs consistently, which neither of the players I mention have really managed during their careers. Plus, he's paid his dues and Malkin, despite his outstanding season and my general admiration for his style needs another stand out season to prove himself. Remember the Bure's and the Selanne's. Both had amazing starts and then became near invisible for much of the rest of their careers. Mats has always been a force, he just rarely had a team with him.
  10. Richard Hawrelak from Sarnia, Canada writes: Sundin, another selfish millionaire athlete. He has a responsibility to maximize his income for the betterment of his family.
  11. JACK V from Canada writes: Another hockey player sucking the crap out of the poor working stiff,as long as they have suckers to pay their huge salaries ,it will not stop . And every one complains about high gas prices, yet continue to pay high ticket prices for what over aged swede. i guess gas is not high enough yet people still have money to blow .
  12. Matt T from Canada writes: Sundin is a $4M player tops at this point.

    His Career Season was in 1992, and has not broke 100 points since. Doug Gilmour had 95 Assists with Toronto in 93' and won MVP. It is now 2008/2009 Season. Sundin is a 2nd/3rd line Center. He has not shown any leadership abilities, and seems to slack off during the season (One reason why Gary Roberts wanted out). He only plays hard when playing for his country.
  13. Paul Bayer from Calgary, Canada writes: Hope he can play at least 60 games this year ... Mind boggling that he would earn more than Ovechkin, Crosby, Iginla , Malkin.... Dumb move.
    Canucks would be overpaying just to get a name on the roster and buy back some fans. He's going to get banged up in the west conference.
  14. Mean Machine from Bugtussle, Canada writes: I can't believe how much many saps will pay to watch sports live,pay the mortgage man good times are followed by bad times.
  15. Dave The Rave from Tabarouetteville, Canada writes: Whatever the truth behind this web of rumor, there is an abundance of plausible scenarios. Paul Kukla, on his excellent 'Kukla's Corner' blog, provides more insight: the suggestion is that the KHL tendered an offer to Sundin, and one of Sundin's posse said, "Yo, we already inked the deal with the Canooks, eh." So what's REALLY up with the Big S? Is JP Barry trying to see just how high the bidding will go for his client? Is Mike 'Magilla Gorilla' Gillis trying to pre-empt the other suitors by offering stupid money (and a lifetime supply of Rogaine) for Mats? Is Mats having sushi (or sashimi) and a massage (by the Swedish Bikini Team) at this very moment? Let us ponder these pithy words..."When a thing ceases to be a subject of controversy, it ceases to be a subject of interest." - William Hazlitt (former netminder for the Chicoutimi Cucumbers of the Canada First Hockey League/Don Cherry, CEO and Commissioner)
  16. Steve Church from Canada writes: Mats isn't ready to play. Last season shredded him on and off the ice. It isn't money and it isn't a conspiracy theory - Sundin has already been the guy you saw and heard. For the good of the Game, I hope he plays and chooses a place where he can just go out and enjoy the Game for a year or two. The sewage-fest he was treated to in Toronto is a crummy way to end his career.
  17. Alen Lager from Brampton, Canada writes: I think it's just a matter of time before Sundin becomes a Canuck. There is no way he is going to leave 5 to 13 million dollers sitting on the table (Canuck's offer verses other rumoured offers).
  18. R Miller from Halifax, Canada writes: "Sundin rumours untrue," but we'll still write a story about 'em.

    I gladly hadn't heard any rumours for awhile before reading Mr. Attfield's latest offering...

    Cheers
  19. Michael Sharp from Victorious, Canada writes:

    Buddy and I disagree.

    I don't want Mats as a Canuck.
    I think he's over-rated.

    Buddy thinks he's a horse.
    Gives it all he has every night.

    Who's right?
    Buddy or me?
  20. D W from Switzerland writes: ".... Remember the Bure's and the Selanne's. Both had amazing starts and then became near invisible for much of the rest of their careers."

    Good one! after all those invisible 60-goal years with Vancouver and Florida, and Selanne's invisible Cup win, they both retired to obscurity!
  21. D W from Switzerland writes: from Wikipedia:
    As a Panther, Bure would lead the league in scoring with back-to-back 58- and 59-goal seasons in 1999-2000 and 2000-01, capturing two Rocket Richard Trophies.

    oops,
    Just 58 and 59 goals late in his career! Watch out with this Malkin kid, a flameout likely!
  22. Nestor C from Canada writes: @ M Sharp from wonderful Victoria, Let me, as a non blinded non bleeting ex Leaf fan, answer your question. You are so very right. Sundin is not a horse.....has never been. For all the sheep that claim otherwise, show me where he stepped up and led the Leafs to anything of substance...where he carried the team on his back to somewhere meaningful (and his back sheep, not the back of Roberts, Nieuwendyk, etc) And now a question for those same sheep.....why is your idol looking to exit Leafland at all???? I thought (and remember reading on these very blogs) that Sundin refused to go elsewhere at the trade deadline because he bled Leaf blue and would never ever ever ever go anywhere else......that would mean that I would expect our buddy Mats to take the exceptionally fair offer the Leafs have proposed to come back to his beloved Toronto........the fact that he hasn't signed on the line for TO just confirms for me that this guy is just like the next guy....out for the buck.....and didn't want to leave TO because he didn't want the added stress of being a focal point in someones playoff run (of course I would have expected Sundin to NOT contribute as his history has shown in TOs playoff runs) He likes TO because it's the only place where you can be worshipped for mediocrity.....Sundin is a good player....he is not a great player.....he may have the skills of a great player but skills are only part of the equation....heart is the other, Sundin doesn't play with passion (except for king and country as others noted) Does anyone think that Gilmour has more raw skill than Sundin? Not but Gilmour accomplished more....because he actually cared about winning in TO.....seeing his skeletal remains after a playoff run only highlighted that point..... Let him go, good riddance and finally allow the Leafs to look beyond a leader that wasn't so much of one......hopefully the next leader will actually deserve the praise and money they earn
  23. bilbo baggins from Canada writes: zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
  24. slapdash dapoint from trawna, Canada writes: $20mil for 2 years...? for a guy who never realised all the dreams everyone else had for him?

    it's like nhl gm's are the same tools who bid up prices on crappy houses and retardify the entire market

    then again, as long as he doesn't put on a leafs sweater, bid away!
  25. Pudge Canuck from TO, Canada writes: Are they sure this is from a swedish paper or a crotian/serbian one?

    "Daily News is completely false, saying that reporter Dusan Umicevic " Sounds like a crotian daily paper....
  26. Devil Bud from T.O., Canada writes: Some of the most ridiculous comments on here. Not entirely unexpected, given the fact that we are talking about Sundin going to a team in the West. Therefore, we have a bunch of Vancouver fans looking up Mats' stats and telling everyone that he is overrated, overpaid, etc. Really? Because, in all honesty, I think Vancouver fans should just look to their team and tell us all what they think someone like Sundin is worth as compared to the rest of the Canucks. That's how salary arbitration works, so look to the Canucks, which is a team loaded with 3rd-liners, and tell everyone how much Sundin is worth. If anyone watched, or paid any attention to the Leafs over the last few years, you would realize that what Sundin accomplishes, with joke linemates, is impressive. Sundin has never had a true top-notch linemate, at the peak of his career, to complement him. If you take all of Sundin's stats, the fact that he has never had secondary support, is a true leader on and off the ice, and is "a horse", then I would like to see the numbers that some of the genius armchair GMs come up with. I am not entirely sold on the $10 mil./yr., but nonetheless, $7mil. is totally expected. So, get out your salary arbitration handbook and tell me what you think, objectively, Sundin is worth.
  27. Neil No more last name from Mississauga, Canada writes: To a team like the Canucks, or the Leafs, who have no bonafide snipers - Sundin is worth at least 7 mill. Don't think he'll help your team??
    Fine diss him, but don't be suprised if he signs and your complaints of him "not being a horse" change after a few games.

    And to the Bravado leaf fan who's "not blinded." I would argue to the contrary. Only the "sheep" think Sundin has not been a true leader because they never played hockey at a competitive level/don't understand his contribution. Hoglund as your winger at the peak of your Career???

    Sakic, Forsberg and Roy in Colorado
    Yzerman, Fedorov, and Lidstrom in Detroit
    Brodeur, Niedermeyer, Stevens in New Jersey

    You don't win Stanley Cups with one hall of famer in your line-up.
  28. J.C. Petite from Toronto, Canada writes: Good post Devil...

    Sundin overrated?? Not consistent?? Plays with no passion??
    Some of the crap posted on here makes me want to vomit. I have watched the Leafs all my life and I have lost count of the amount of times that Sundin has totally dominated a game. There has been nights where he was just simply unstoppable, other nights he was medicore but show me a player that does not have off nights. People talk about his lack of production in the playoffs?? Take a look at his playoff stats....very respectable. The guys has had like 13 consecutive seasons where he has scored over 75 points. He leads the NHL in overtime winners. Not to mention the garbage that he has had to play with during his career. The best player that Mats ever got to play with was Alex Mogilny (when he was way past his prime) and he lit it up with him. Sure its an old argument, but really think about it....he has had nobody. But I digress, you guys can rip on him all you want, just remember to overlook his name when you are reading the NHL'S BEST PLAYERS OF ALL TIME book.
  29. Marc Langels from writes: In all honesty I am pretty shocked. There seems to be a pretty large number of Maple Leafs fans, who cannot wait for Sundin to sign elsewhere so they can cry foul and ridicule him. What in the world has he done wrong? Should he have left the sinking ship long ago? That's just not the type of person he is. He held out hope for too long, that the higher powers at MLSE actually build a team that can male a rund at the Cup. He could have pulled a Hasek on the Leafs. Demanded a trade (presumably to the Wings) and as a little farewell told them, what was a good enough compensation (so the trade wouldn't ruin his chance at the Cup). He didn't. And for what? He gets no respect at all. Now he hasn't even decided, IF he wants to play another year. If he was so bullish on money he would have taken the offer from the Canucks. But the thing is, he doesn't know, if he wants to play and for how long. Reminds me a bit of a QB from Green Bay, whom they called a warrior, a class act and everything else and now they don't want him back. Word of advice for Mats (who probably doesn't need it): stay in Sweden, enjoy life and leave those haters behind. And every once in a while look at the standings and search for the Leafs. Another advice: start at the bottom, should save you some time.
  30. Alfie Didn't Choke.... Like Really... from Canada writes: If the guy just wanted the money, he'd have taken the offer. He had crappy linemates in toronto. He's only led the team in scoring the last 10 years or so, many of them under Pat Quinn who would roll four lines and not give him 20 minutes a game. The guy's a class act and he owes the Leafs nothing, especially when the team refused to let the trade deadline possibility of a trade die, even when he said he wasn't going. They tried to pressure him, and he's not happy about it. 10 mill? Naw, that's crazy money. 5 or 6 is more like it at this point. He is a great player and yeah, he performs well for his country cuz he's actually had some other great players around him. I am not talking about Jonus Hoglund.
  31. Eddie Kated from Canada writes:

    He had a chance to go to a contender, on a trade last season. It would have been a great move for the Leafs and an early start on a re-build. He wouldn't go. He stayed here so the team could do just well enough to climb out of a descent draft position. Only the most blind of fans ever thought there was a chance at the playoffs, and if that miracle was to happen, there was no way on earth the Leafs would have made it to round two.

    I am sick of hearing what a "team player" this guy is. If he goes elsewhere now, and the team gets nothing for him, the guy is a complete dirt bag.

    .
  32. JEFF S from Canada writes: Remember when the media was employeed to report on FACTS. Now, in the internet age, in a rush to "break a story".....reporting on RUMOURS is what we get.

    Oh well......I guess it's a FACT that this is a RUMOUR.
  33. Marc Langels from writes: Sundin's a guy, who goes to war for your team every night for ten-plus-years and when he doesn't wave his no-trade (which he had every right to since he earned it the hard way) he is the nemesis? Way to go Maple Lefas fans. But the blame here goes directly to management. Why did they hand out no-trades like they were going out of style? Kaberle, McCabe etcetc. So where lies the blame? But everyone blames Sundin for not wanting to leave? How srewed is that? For all the inability to built a contender over the years maybe the Leafs deserve the hole they find themselves in?
  34. David Heath from Canada writes: I'm with you Eddie.
  35. Matt T from Canada writes: Roberts, Yzerman, Ovechkin, Messier, Brodeur are workhorses. Sundin is not even in the same league as this guys. Sundin is a slacker. That is why Gary Roberts wanted out of Toronto (because the Captain did not want to put in the extra effort on and off the ice). I mean just watch Sundin skate, and compare to other players. He coasts 80% of the time. He has a very lazy stride when he does skate. I don't believe I have EVER seen the guy skate back to help the defence, he just jumps off the ice. Why wasn't Sundin able to break 100 points when he first came the Leafs? He was with Gilmour/Clark etc.

    He does not deserve to be a $10M player. There are very few players you can put up at $10M.

    The REAL superstars make the other players on their team better. Ovechkin, Crosby, Yzerman, Gretzky, Messier, Lemieux, Sakic etc.

    Sundin is the most overrated guy in the league. The only reason he broke 100 points in 1992!!!! (16 years ago), was because he was playing for the Nordiques (Who then won the Stanley Cup after he was traded).
  36. Marc Langels from writes: Oh really Matt, he was with the Leafs when Clark was there? I thought he was the guy who Clark was traded for! And the Nordiques won the Cup with/after the Lindros and Roy trades. So be fair and honest when it comes to comparisons. And the guys you listed who won Cups? Yzerman won after he was surrounded by talent, Gretzky never won without Edmonton (e.g. Messier, Kurri et al). Lemieux won with the likes of Coffey, Jagr, Barrasso etc. Sakic had Forsberg, Roy, Claude Lemieux. Sundin never had it that good.
  37. Nestor C from Canada writes: To be clear.....

    Sundin owes the Leafs absolutely nothing....he owed them nothing at the trade deadline and owes them nothing now. He was fulfilling his contractual obligations and no one can begrudge him that.....but.....those questioning his motives to block a trade were countered with "He loves TO and won't ever leave" by the sheep and similar words to that effect from the man himself.....and no all of a sudden he starts looking elsewhere? Why I ask??? Perhaps these reasons:

    1) He likes being paid exceptionally well in Toronto for being the best player on a sad team

    2) He likes earning best player money in a town where expectations are high yes, but any (and I mean any) success makes you a god

    3) Once god status is achieved, said best player needs answer to no one on why the best player is chronically unable to make his teammates better or lead them to the promised land

    4) Why get traded to a team and be 'The Guy' for the playoff run so when you fail to produce (and he would fail to produce) you'd be tagged as the goat because you're not a god in that town (of course this hurts legacy and future earning potential)

    of course there is more...but why go too deep.....
  38. Nestor C from Canada writes: My bad...my previous post was why he blocked the trade at the deadline....

    why he would welcome a move now out of town are easy....he is a win win situation...big time money is a lock of course but....so say win win win......win win because:

    He wins the Cup with a stronger cast leading the charge (which is certainly needed in Sundins case....) so he goes down as a winner (finally) and puts credibility into the sheeps statements of him needing a stronger cast

    He floats as normal, puts up his usually better than average numbers but ends up losing on a squad for whatever reason......people keep saying he's a great player , just look at his numbers! He just needs a stronger cast (cue Vancouver.....which is why he will likely go there....so much like TO except more money)

    He floats as normal and his numbers drop off etc.....well chalk it up to him getting old etc.....Canucks took a risk and it doesn't pay off....oh well....

    Either way, his own legacy is never tarnished.....call it our own version of the Teflon Don....
  39. Neil No more last name from Mississauga, Canada writes: The debate rages on between Leaf fans.

    No one is willing to touch my comment with a ten foot pole, doesn't suprise me.

    Please rebute the fact that the most dominate teams of the last 15 years (all time?) all had multiple hall of famers, in their own right, on their teams.

    Please rebute the fact that the Leafs idea of building a contender was plopping overpaid, over the hill veterans into their lineup at the trade deadline, as opposed to building a team through player development.

    If you cannot, you should be able to understand why Sundin "Has never done anything" as you people put it. Man he's not even close to my favourite player, and I can appreciate what he's done for the Leafs.
  40. Nestor C from Canada writes: Neil no more....how many HoFers does Ovechkin have right now? He's pretty good right?
  41. Devil Bud from T.O., Canada writes: Matt T: You are obviously bent on making bold statements with absolutely no connection to reality. First off, not only did Roberts tear a strip off of TML management when he was not offered a proper deal, subsequently heading to Florida, but he continuously sought a trade back to the Leafs. You are so far off, it is almost sad...except you probably believe what you say, which actually does make it sad. Secondly, your "he should make those around him better"...who says he didn't? Lets see: Jonas Hoglund, Antropov, Poni, Mogilny (past his prime), Gilmour (past his prime), Clark (way past his prime). Sundin coasts? WTF? The guy is an absolute workhorse. Can anyone in the NHL honestly say that they don't mind Sundin controlling the puck in their end? No one can get the puck off him without the most physical of exertion. As for Sundin's defensive play, maybe you know something that no one else knows, but there isn't much bit.ching about it amongst pro analysts. However, you are very entitled to your distorted version of reality. BTW, there is a reason why he is the captain of the Swedish national team, current Olympic Gold medalists. And that is not based on his ability to put people in the stands, the size of his contract, etc. It is because he is the #1 player/leader on that team. Once again, if you disagree with any of the experts, then you must be a very wise man. Why don't you contact TSN, I hear they're looking for someone to fill Healey's spot.
  42. Neil No more last name from Mississauga, Canada writes: Nestor C from Canada - And Ovechkin has won how many playoff series?

    Were talking someone who has played in the league for 3 years vs. someone who has played in the league for close to twenty. Hard to compare.

    What about the rest that I listed?

    from what i understood at last year's trade deadline - he wanted to play with a team from October - June, not be a rental player. That's the explanation I got out of it, and i pretty much inferred , that he be leaving over the summer for greener pastures.

    My theory (and this is all theoritical anyways) is he was waiting to see the Leafs course of action over the summer - if they planned to rebuild he figured himself outside of the equation, if they were to band-aid again and try to appear as competitive next season he'd stick around to help out. I think he'd like to stick around in Toronto, but is having a hard time jusifying it.

    anways, heresay is fun, no?
  43. Neil No more last name from Mississauga, Canada writes: Please rebute the fact that the most dominate teams of the last 15 years (all time?) all had multiple hall of famers, in their own right, on their teams.

    Nestor C - Ovechkin is good, but the Capitals are hardly a dominate team.
    He didn't single handedly beat the Flyers, in fact the capitals didn't beat the Flyers in the first round at all.

    That comparsion is out the window.

    Try it with the red Wings, Avs, and NJ
  44. 58 Studebaker from Canada writes: Why is this news??? No team is really going to pay Sundin $20mil for 2 seasons. He's not worth it and everyone knows it. Good gawd people he's barely a point per game player (1.01 ppg for his career).

    Let Mats go back to Sweden and his Mom can feed him Campbell's Chunky Soup, I hear it's the soup that eats like a meal. Belly up Mats!!
  45. Ryan M from Ottawa, Canada writes: 58 Studebaker - the Canucks have already made the offer, so apparently there is a team that would really pay him that much.

    That said, I don't think he's worth it. He's a good player, no doubt, but isn't worth anywhere close to $10M per season.

    Does Vancouver really think dishing out this kind of cash would actually help their hurting offence that much? I doubt it...
  46. Devil Bud from T.O., Canada writes: If Sundin were to go to Vancouver, it would be truly sad. It would fly in the face of everything he has said and done his entire career. He would basically be taking a huge payday to go to a complete non-contender. I mean, come on now. Vancouver doesn't even have 1 guy on their roster that is a legit. 1st liner. Ok, ok, Luongo. Haha. However, if he wants to stay true to what he has said he has 3 options: 1) Sign with a contender, so that if he wins the Cup with them, he can say that he was a "real" member of the team (start to finish); 2) Sign with the Leafs and help players develop during the rebuilding process; or 3) Retire. Pretty simple, because going to a loser team such as Vancouver is only for one thing - MONEY, which he has completely rejected in the past.
  47. Neil No more last name from Mississauga, Canada writes: 10 Mill is way over the top. I think the hope was he couldn't possibly say no to that kind of money, and it would scare off all other suitors. apparently not (yet)

    More in the 7 mill - one season range. shoot he played for 5.5 last year just to stay in Toronto
  48. wayne powers from saskatoon, writes: According to the news Sweden is having a terrible mosquito problem, so why would Mats be out fishing or even staying around Sweden. If he was from out here I could see it, we don't have any bugs this year. Really you can drive out on the highways and the windshield isn't coated with bugs.
    So he must be really undecided about his future.
  49. Neil No more last name from Mississauga, Canada writes: Wayne Powers - interesting angle.

    Now we've definitely over analyzing. (i'm guilty)
  50. Matt T from Canada writes: Sundin a sniper?

    He finished last season as 81st in shooting % (Stajan Finished ahead of him). Averaging 14.1% over his career. Career high was in 1992 (21.9%)

    Watch Sundin skate (and compare his speed/stride to those on the other team, not on the same team for obvious reasons). He never hustles back for the back check. He will just jump back on the bench.

    He is Captain of the Swedish team because he actually tries and plays hard for them. There is a huge difference in his individual skill when he plays for his country. Yes he does have a lot better players on his team, but he is playing against top defenders in the league during this time.

    He should be getting the most points on the Leafs, averaging about (20:27) of ice time per game.

    Ovechkin is no doubt a Hall of Famer. What other Hall of Famers are on his team? Most of the players on his team seems to get better playing with him

    Who did Sidney Crosby have first year with the Penguins?

    He is starting to get injured http://www2.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/players/Mats_Sundin
    Either that or take a regularly scheduled vacation.

    Why in all honesty would a guy way past his prime be worth anything more than $5M is my question?
    Who cares what he has done in 1992. There are about 50-80 players that far exceed his skills.
  51. Neil No more last name from Mississauga, Canada writes: Nah Matt T - Sidney Crosby did what in his first year without Hossa and Malkin? Didn't even make the playoffs.

    Ovechkin has won how many playoff rounds??

    If your gonna give me a stats package, give me the goods - OT goals

    Again - who's willing to debate against my Det, NJ, and Avs statements ???
    If you guys don't remember those years pre-lockout, then I'm not sure if it's worth debating

    10 mill is certainely too much. And his defensive game is not his best attribute, but he is 78 over his career in the NHL, and was 17 last year on a horrid leaf team.
  52. Rob C from Canada writes: Apparently Claude Wearing has also signed up with the Toronto Maple Leaf fan Club for this year as well. (this will be good)
  53. Neil No more last name from Mississauga, Canada writes: while we're on the topic of plus/minus, Lidstrom is a whopping plus 378 over his career. That's just crazy good!
  54. Devil Bud from T.O., Canada writes: I still don't get Matt T's comments. There is absolutely no connection between your claims and your conclusions. Sundin plays hard for Sweden, but not for the Leafs? Are you sure? Pretty easy claim to make, but like I said before, not many agree on that one, as in not a criticism that comes up amongst GMS and analysts. Ovechkin a no doubt hall of famer? Hmmmm....is Alexander Mogilny a no doubter? Be very careful with your no doubters, because careers will be judged based on careers, not what your first few years were like. As such, Ovechkin still has a while to go before he can be a "no doubter", although all signs point to the right direction on that one. As for the 50-80 better players in the NHL...I would like to see that list. Just another example of the absurdity of your opinions that are obviously bent on some sort of bias. Team Finland supporter or Sens fan? Haha...whatever.
  55. Neil No more last name from Mississauga, Canada writes: Team Finland supporter -

    That's a good one. never thought of that.
  56. J.C. Petite from Toronto, Canada writes: Since when has Sundin had a bad skating stride?? Maybe it appears that way (Matt T) because he is a big guy but he is a lot faster than you think he is.

    A quick look at Sundins unquestionable skillset :

    Rocket Slap Shot
    Dead accurate backhand
    Uncanny ability to protect the puck
    Outstanding ability to bury the puck when close to the net
    Can beat pretty much any goalie in the league on a breakaway

    The guy IS a sniper, Leaf fans will attest to the fact that Sundin almost always puts the puck in the net when given a great chance to do so.

    Is he worth 10mil?? Nope, I would say there are maybe three guys that deserve that kind of cash right now: Crosby, Ovechkin, Malkin. But he is not overrated.....Hall of Famers are not overrated.
  57. Billy Talon from Toronto, Canada writes: Matt T from Canada writes: Sundin a sniper?

    He finished last season as 81st in shooting % (Stajan Finished ahead of him). Averaging 14.1% over his career. Career high was in 1992 (21.9%)

    Watch Sundin skate (and compare his speed/stride to those on the other team, not on the same team for obvious reasons). He never hustles back for the back check. He will just jump back on the bench.

    He is Captain of the Swedish team because he actually tries and plays hard for them. There is a huge difference in his individual skill when he plays for his country. Yes he does have a lot better players on his team, but he is playing against top defenders in the league during this time.

    ***

    Thanks for the stats...Although I disagree with your post, it's nice to see some stats supporting your argument.

    But your comparison on his skating (speed/stride) in response to others is baseless.

    I've watched him, and don't see what you are seeing, sorry.

    He's a 78 over his career for plus/minus - so I don't think he doesn't skate back to his own end.

    http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/teams/players/bio/?id=1215

    So he tries with team Sweden, but he doesn't try with the Leafs? That doesn't make sense at all.
  58. Scot Loucks from Pickering, Canada writes: Matt T from Canada writes: Sundin is a $4M player tops at this point.

    His Career Season was in 1992, and has not broke 100 points since. Doug Gilmour had 95 Assists with Toronto in 93' and won MVP. It is now 2008/2009 Season. Sundin is a 2nd/3rd line Center. He has not shown any leadership abilities, and seems to slack off during the season (One reason why Gary Roberts wanted out.

    --------------------------------------------------------

    My you sure have a lot to say for someone that doesn't know what they are talking about.

    I guess you should be on the horn letting Gainey, Sather and Gillis know about your revelations.... oh and don't forget Fletcher and Holland.

    The offers for Sundin varied from 7m (Toronto) all the way up to 10m (Vancouver). With Montreal, Detroit and NY in between. Guess they didn't read your scouting reports Matt.

    btw fool.... Gary Roberts didn't leave Toronto because he wanted to. He left because JFJ low balled him with the contract offer.

    If you are going to troll.... at least get your facts straight.

    Cheers
  59. Andrew Cheng from Canada writes: Mats can do whatever he wants. No one force-fed a no-trade clause in his previous contract and now he's a free agent.
  60. Neil No more last name from Mississauga, Canada writes: Well you can always count on Scot to straighten out the rookies,

    hey look at that - you're the Gary Roberts of the G&M comments section!
  61. Tim Cares from Canada writes: Cliff, many fans and many reporters/columnists show the same lack of class as Harold Ballard.
    Treat captains like sh*t when they get older.

    I think he is waiting for Cliff to drop dead before he resigns with the Leafs.

    Of course, maybe he will come back with a paper bag over his head for the signing news conference.

    I probably shouldn't give Cliff any ideas.
  62. Aaron Barlow from Victoria, Canada writes: I think Neil No and others have analyzed this situation correctly. Sundin is not worth $10M/year to a team like Montreal, Detriot, Pittsburg, etc. They already have people who can score. Vancouver doesn't. They were one of the lowest scoring teams in the league last year, if I remember correctly. And now they are down Naslund and Morrison (neither of whom have been as good as Sundin in recent years), who did put some points on the board. Nobody as good as Sundin is available on the market at the moment, so the Canucks have decided to try to get the best available player to complete their team, until they can develop some new scoring talent. To them, $7, $8, even $10M is worth it, because there is nobody better in the short term. They can't afford not to get him--and they can't afford to let any Western Conference rivals snatch him up.
  63. Yves Champoux from Trois-Rivieres, Canada writes: Old Mat just got married. Stretching the honey moon than will pull a Selane
    and comme back sometime around Chrismast for 5 million bucks. Lucky
    Swede! Now, who says he 'deserves' to play for a winning team. Isn't he
    supposed to make the difference?
  64. Scot Loucks from Pickering, Canada writes: Yves Champoux from Trois-Rivieres.... it was reported in another paper that they interviewed Mats in Sweden. He said that he would be making his decision at the end of July or early August.

    He went on to say that if he does decide to play that both Toronto (where he wants to play) and Vancouver were in the running.

    He also said that if he did play he would be playing for the whole year and he would head back to North America in early August.

    Cheers
  65. MapleLeaf Bacon from Killaloe, Canada writes: Mats take the 20 mil from Vancouver and retire with your 26 year old hot babe. The the smart move!
  66. Yves Champoux from Trois-Rivieres, Canada writes: Scott Loucks...I'm in a festive mood. Just meant that I would gladly trade
    places with good old Mats.
  67. Rob B from Canada writes: Mats should do one of two things - stay in Sweden or re-sign with the Leafs. Either way his chances of winning the Stanley Cup are the same. He has proven only one thing during his NHL career, and that was that he has no interest of playing past the end of the regular season (when a player is no longer compenstated for playing, unless he is on the cup winning team, and then only for a fraction of what he would make during the regular season). Since the Leafs are unlikely to make the playoffs until Sundin is a grand father, he should be quite comfortable taking their money. I suppose a third option would be the Canuks who are the western version of the Leafs.
  68. Ed Op from Canada writes: I still say he's going to retire a Leaf. Hope that means he comes back for one or two more years.
  69. Jah Nee Kah Sun from Canada writes: Vancouver means $
    Toronto means...well, a joke
    Montreal means glory
    Sundin will wear the glorious Tricolore jersey
  70. Montgomery C. Burns from Springfield, Canada writes: Mats is weighing all of his options. He will make his decision on his own timetable.
  71. Patricia Timms from Canada writes: Hold on guys
    You say the Canucks haven't got a hope in shiite for the Stanley Cup
    Well neither did Dallas
    Supposedly neither did the Flames.
    But personally I do fear you are right about the Canucks.

    The west is the west--whoever wins the west--wins the Cup right?
    Well the Canucks were a BETTER team than the Stars and the Stars came close. As good as Calgary/Denver/Minny and better than some.
    The west is always a toss-up and usually there are 5/6 losing teams that are still better than the two Eastern Conf finalists.

    For FOUR years the Sharks have been the best of the VERY best
    And how many cups did the Sharks win--Ask the Leafs new coach?

    This year keep an eye on the speedy Oilers.
    Especially an unknown kid (back east) named Brule.
    Trouble with the Oilers is:--they have good eastern style goaltending, but not good enough for the west though.
  72. Patricia Timms from Canada writes: Hey you Canuck detractors.
    Gillis says Canucks won't be playing kitty-bar-the-door TRAP hockey this year.

    Bet not many in T.O. stay up past mid-night to become familiar with those young (very improving) 3rd and 4th liners. At least 2 unknowns ready for the top two lines (right now) And the Jets are filled with as many good scorers as the Marlies have (almost).

    Don't be as shocked as I will be if they are a changed club this year.
    Remember 3rd best D in the NHL and maybe 2nd, 3rd no lower than 4th best goal tender to stop the blobs up front. We'll know by Christmas--And I want to be shocked PLEASANTLY.

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