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Housing slump stalks Western Canada

TAVIA GRANT

From Friday's Globe and Mail

Latest comment posted at 1:03 AM EST 08/08/08

Major cities in Saskatchewan, Alberta and B.C. are overvalued by 10 per cent, economists say as key construction indicator tumbles ...Read the full article

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  1. Michael Sharp from Victoria, Canada writes:

    Oh yes.

    People with high mortgage payments are going to be all over getting taxed on everything by Dion, aren't they?

    They're going to love that.

    Not.
  2. DOUBLE J from Canada writes: Wait for it--- Coming to a post near you, Bill K and his 'pop, what was that?' idiotic comments. Bill I've got a house for you to rent.
  3. Ricky for a Centrist Canada from Canada writes:
    And not-so-Sharp continues his legacy of off-topic trolling.
  4. Michael Sharp from Victoria, Canada writes:

    Ricky for a Centrist Canada?

    Completely on-topic, buddy.
    Real estate sales are down, the economy is slowing.
    Dion wants to tax everything.
    CPC majority.

    Completely on-topic, sport.

    Try to keep up.
  5. Typical Toronto Voter from Toronto, Canada writes: You can always count on the G&M to give us Toronto types feel-good stories like this one.
  6. Captain Ontario from Canada writes: Southern Ontario rules again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  7. Michael Sharp from Victoria, Canada writes:

    Ricky, you are NOT an idiot.
    Your prognostications are by far and away the best these threads have ever seen.
    I eagerly await your every post.

    You should be on the Globe editorial board, you're that smart.

    Keep up the good work.
    We're counting on you.
  8. Johnn Baraka from Victoria, Canada writes: Cash will be king soon and I will be waiting in the wings to snap up a property that people bought when many people thought they 'must have a home' but are soon going to be falling behind on their mortgages.

    Some people have overextended themselves into oblivion and I will be there like a vulture to clean up the mess.

    Thanks!
  9. Michael Sharp from Victoria, Canada writes:

    OK, boys and girls, see if you can stay with me.

    The economy is slowing.
    Real estate is dropping.
    Money is tight.

    Which means, of course that people will eagerly do their bit to pay more money so Toronto can have day care.

    You're quick little lefty bunnies, you see where this goes, don't you?

    Dropping real estate values are not congruent with increased taxation.

    Gawd, it's like talking to bricks.
  10. Cognitively Cogitative from Urbia, Canada writes: Well as a renter I'm pretty happy about this. Maybe I still have a chance of buying a house here in the city I was born in. I remember back in the day when a house represented a place for shelter rather than a vehicle in which to make obscene amounts of money. Well, thats the way it is here in Vancouver. Lots of houses and condos stand empty here, heated and consuming energy so that offshore speculators can flip[ them. Its a real shame with our homeless problem as a backdrop. Things could use a little cooling off.
  11. Harold Alan from Victoria from Canada writes: A bit of pull back on housing prices here would be a good thing. The way housing has rocketed the last five years, middle class families cannot afford a home. In my neighborhood you have to earn over $70,000/yr. to afford a mortgage. That's nuts. A bit of reality in prices just might make it possible for the people who staff this city's infastructure to be able to afford to live here. I think 35% is an overstatement, but 15-20% still would give everyone a good profit and allow others into the market.
  12. Mark Hepburn from Vancouver, Canada writes: Finally. I've been waiting for this news forever. Real estate in Vancouver is ridiculously overpriced. Since moving to Vancouver just 3 years ago, the average price of a house has nearly doubled. Buying a shoebox of a condo is out of reach for most people in their 20's even 30's. I can't wait until prices become their true 'fair value'.
  13. Misery Lastname from Angus, Canada writes: The greedy lenders wanted it all. Lend with no down payment. Don't worry about proving your income. Get a phony appraisal. The perfect storm. Housing boomed then credit tightened and housing collapses. People got huge commissions. There was so much greed that now they are choking on it. And our government was complicit in the whole deal. Who foots the bill. the tax payer of course.
  14. Marty York from Canada writes: Nothing like a professional investment firm to strike fear in the hearts of homeowners. This country runs on appreciating house prices to borrow against and spend. In Calgary, the prices have already dropped 20 percent, and people are still moving here from Ontario, etc. I agree with the Saskatchewan prices dropping, wages are not as high there and the prices are overvalued.
  15. R Miller from Halifax, Canada writes: Hey, I kinda feel left out of this thread...

    It looks like Cities from every region got mentioned on that vulnerable list except Cities in Atlantic Canada....

    I thought that this was the 'National Newspaper, C of the U'

    Oppppppsssss...... Never mind !
  16. The Last Honest Conservative from Western, Canada writes:
    yawn.................
    so the Alberta Drug Lords are going lose 10%
  17. Harold Alan from Victoria from Canada writes: Having watched the housing cycle here for the last few decades it reminds me of pulling a wagon with an elastic band. Walk too fast and you get, 'stretch and contract' the faster you go, the more the stretch and the more the contract. The idea is to find the ideal walking speed that gives you a smooth ride. This however is not possible--too many variables. The wheels are not falling off. I would not panic sell.
  18. Action Jackson from Canada writes: This is just the usual 'bust' in Alberta's boom-&-bust economy. More generally, now that commodities' prices are dropping, the western provinces' economies will cool, the Cdn $ will drop, and Ontario will heat up a bit. But this might have been the last boom for Alberta -- with all the hybrids and electric cars coming to market in the next few years, oil won't get this hot again.
  19. Harold Alan from Victoria from Canada writes: Action Jackson, don't count on it. Forestry in BC is dead as a doornail but the economy will outperform most of the country. Once forestry restructures and gets going again, we may just sail off into the sunset. See if you can keep up.
    Same for Alberta and Sask. Bye bye.
  20. Scott Wagstaff from Vancouver, Canada writes: Just wait until everybody who bought multiple condo's try to sell during the 2010 Olympics.
  21. James MacDonald from Edmonton, Canada writes: Edmonton house prices are way overvalued. I would say it has to come down back to earth by about 50%.
  22. June from Western Canada from Canada writes: The real estate market is so hyped with greed that I'm glad to see prices drop. It's too bad they couldn't have put a lid of 10-20% resale above assessed value...Housing would have remained affordable with slower rises in wages and income and wouldn't throw people into the over extended markets as there is no place to rent, either. Low cost housing is practically nil...manufactured home parks are closing everywhere for development....This creates the panic for people who end up with nothing, homeless...or move in with relatives (God help us). Property Taxes would have stayed reasonable, not forcing people to move because of high property values. We just create our own inflation so some smart developers/real estate sales people/ investors make obscene amounts of profits in flipping property. Values are way out of whack. We went through this in the 80's and a lot of people lost everything ...bought high..can't sell low. Sell a home in Vancouver, come to rural areas where the prices are cheap and inflate those prices above what wages can support. Sometimes the free market is self defeating......Now we don't have enough workers or families to fill our school rooms.
  23. Terry Quinn from Canada writes: The fact that Toronto has been named one of the top ten Cities in the world by Forbes and the fact that house prices there are stable must really get all western tories fuming mad. Toronto votes liberal and the ROC might see that in the proper light. Stability equals Liberal.

    Sharp and his idiotic ramblings are no match for the ballot box. Dion's

    Green shift seems to be consolidating his vote at a higher number as summer winds on. That is a very good sign for Canada.
  24. R Miller from Halifax, Canada writes: Terry Quinn from Canada writes:

    'Green shift seems to be consolidating his vote at a higher number as summer winds on...'

    And your ramblings are supposedly so logical compared to Mr. Sharp's ?

  25. d p from writes: Does anybody have a link to the actual report?

    I also think prices got a bit out of hand. But in Canada we had real reasons for the increase in house prices... the price of oil, lots of jobs and a healthy economy. It was not just a liquidity influenced boom like the U.S.

    House prices in Alberta have peaked, but problems in the Middle East could lead back to higher oil prices. Somebody starts shooting, the price of oil goes back above $130 for a long period of time, and Alberta real estate prices could claw back some recent declines.

    Alberta can be boom or bust, its not a game for the weak or undercapitalized.
  26. diane marie from calgary, Canada writes: June, I feel that I've seen it all: a conservative/CPC-supporter who wants price controls on housing. Out of curiosity, have you ever considered taking out a membership in the NDP?
  27. JEANNE FARINE from Vancouver, Canada writes: Greed usually produces disappointment in the longer term. The problem with that principle today is that too much of the financial and corporate worlds are protected from the consequences of their own excesses by governments which fail in their responsibilities to serve the public majority...ordinary citizens and small businesses who pay the bulk of the tax revenue and suffer the most real economic and social pain when the greed machines overheat and crash.
  28. S.L. S from Small Town, Canada writes: Although I have noticed quite a few 'reduced' signs, houses in my neck of Sask are still selling quite rapidly and at higher value than they should be. I haven't seen a slow down here. I have noticed that alot are listed exceptionally high so that once the 'reduced' sign goes up, people think they're getting a deal when in reality it's still more than the seller was thinking it was worth. Strange market out here right now.
  29. Bob B from United Kingdom writes: 10% sounds like fiction. Secure your seats for 25-35% in Vancouver and Victoria for houses and up to 50% for condos.
  30. evelyn robinson from Canada writes: Dion doesn't want to tax everything; that is already being done with Mulroneys gst.
  31. R Miller from Halifax, Canada writes: Just remember it's only money...

    You all still have your health and a great country to live in.

    Cheer up for Gawd's sake !
  32. John Deriso from Edmonton, Canada writes: When I saw some workmen put up a huge sign advertising '400,000$ condos!' on my block here in Edmonton consisting of apartment buildings which can best be described as 'crack dens', I knew the bust was near.

    I hope all those greedy folk who kept buying up everything they could get their hands on to flip a week later get hosed hard. Those people are leeches.
  33. Ricky for a Centrist Canada from Canada writes:
    John Deriso - amen.
  34. Charles Smith from United Kingdom writes: The scary part about this is that it is happening with interest rates at record lows, and employment at record highs. When has this happened before? Folks, this is heading to uglyville. I blame the Feds in the USA and the BC for not moving quickly enough long-time ago to quell re-estate inflation. Places like Australia and NZ started lifting rates as far back as 2003 – I think they made the right move.
  35. Charles Smith from United Kingdom writes: R Miller from Halifax, Canada writes: 'Just remember it's only money...

    You all still have your health and a great country to live in.'

    I agree - maybe people will focus more on what really matters in life!
  36. john doe from Canada writes: it's because western canadian markets our now out of rich for pretty much any first time home buyer at this point. Anybody who wanted a single detached house in van, vic or calgary was paying north of a half million to live on the out skirts since no the wage increases did not keep up with the rise in housing cost it's no wonder we are going to see a correction.
  37. martha stewart from Canada writes: Charles Smith from United Kingdom - I agree sort of. Except those moves don't seem to be helping in Australia or New Zealand.

    But you forgot to mention the extreme real estate inflation in the UK... another bubble.
  38. Charles Smith from United Kingdom writes: martha stewart from Canada - Agreed, the UK is in trouble; however, I don't believe that Australia's real-estate market is teetering the same; for example, Sydney has seen prices soften since 2003, but rebounded in 2007 - prices are not in the stratosphere for Sydney, but then keep in mind that variable rates are at 9.5% (imagine if rates were at 5.5%), and homes are still selling. No doubt there is still talk of pricing coming off in Oz, but the magnitude is not likely to be as severe as places like Saskatoon even though, a nice place; I spent a bit of time there, staying at the old Bessborough Hotel along the river.
  39. David Kanaschwiiz from Switzerland writes:
    Title: Housing slump stalks Western Canada

    The 'slump' 'stalks'? Ouch.
  40. Vern McPherson from writes:
    I like the part about the 'frenzied speculators in Saskatoon'. LOL !!

    If this is anything like the Winnipeg boom in 1881 some volk have a surprise in store ......
  41. fergus macduff from United Kingdom writes: maybe i will be able to buy a nice house in saskatoon for a good price.
  42. A Canadian from Cole Harbour, Canada writes: Ricky the centrist. Here is some info for you. This is dated aug 7 2008

    http://www.robbinssceresearch.com/polls/poll_509.html

    If an election were held tomorrow for which party would you support?

    Jack Layton and New Democrat 19.5 %
    Stephane Dion and Liberal Party 28.0 %
    Gilles Duceppe and Bloc 9.0 %
    Elizabeth May and Green Party 6.0 %
    Stephen Harper and Conservatives 37.5 %
    Undecided 16 %

    Do you support a Stephane Dion carbon tax and other aggressive government measures to combat global warming?
    Yes 32 %
    No 52 %
  43. bill k from Canada writes: 'As Merrill Lynch Canada economist David Wolf correctly points out, the average house here is now equal to four times the average household income. During the last boom market (1989) which ended in bust, that ratio topped out at just over three times income. In the United States, where there is a real estate depression, the ratio at the peak was less than it is here right now.'
  44. bill k from Canada writes: More info at greaterfool.ca. The facts are hard for many to swallow. 'Real estate sales levels are plunging in every major city, from 42% in Vancouver to 12% last month alone in Toronto. At the same time, the number of people trying to sell their homes has exploded. More than 64,000 resales are on the market at the moment. In the GTA, the choice for buyers compared to this time last year has mushroomed by a third.'
  45. Stude Ham from Outremont, Canada writes:
    does all this mean that the money supplies which fuelled the exhorbitant accomodation and shelter prices is not as elastic as the greedy real estate vultures believed?
  46. Vern McPherson from writes:
    Who is Glen P Robbins ???

    And plese no one tell me he is the prez of his own polling CO OK ??
  47. Ricky for a Centrist Canada from Canada writes:
    Cole Harbour - Interesting results from a small, BC-based pollster who's done work for the BC 'Liberals' (who are really cons) and the CPC.

    Thanks, I'll wait for the Nanos poll

    But having a variety of viewpoints is good.
  48. Sunny Breaks from the beach, Canada writes: ShamWOW! Are you following me, camera guy?
  49. A Canadian from Cole Harbour, Canada writes: Vern McPherson from writes: Who is Glen P Robbins ???

    You are a smart guy and I gave you a link to the web site. I will let you do your own research.

    Have a nice day
  50. A Canadian from Cole Harbour, Canada writes: Vern McPherson from writes:
    Who is Glen P Robbins ???

    And plese no one tell me he is the prez of his own polling CO OK ??

    --

    Almost forgot, would the numbers be more meaningfull to you if they came from Earnscliffe and the person running the poll was either Scott Reid or David Earle.
  51. David Bakody from Dartmouth, Canada writes: Down you say, best chat with Flaherty and Harper.....they are making money hand over fist for their soon to be election from all those rich cowboys. How could it be they pay little or no taxes and are making bundles of cash driving big pick ups and falling all because of Harper's new Canada with a 5% GST. 'Acountability' works wonders hey?
  52. David Bakody from Dartmouth, Canada writes: A Canadian from Cole Harbour, yup no problem budds. the most soggy weather in history pal, and more bad news to come, but heck I live in Dartmouth NS and the grass needs more water as it is all burnt brown....but the kids are happy from all the swimming in warm waters....oh yea, the Atlantic Ocean is up 4 % and hurricane season is here. Good news hey? VOTE ABC.....soon
  53. bob saunders from Belleville, ON, Canada writes: evelyn robinson from Canada writes: Dion doesn't want to tax everything; that is already being done with Mulroneys gst.============= YOU mean the TAX the LIBERAL PROMISED to get rid of. And no food doesn't have GST.
  54. A Canadian from Cole Harbour, Canada writes: David Bakody from Dartmouth as usual your rants make no sense.

    Good bye
  55. Cameron M from Toronto, Canada writes: Military officer in N.B. charged with child pornography offences
    The GAM doesn't think this is newsworthy
  56. Vern McPherson from writes:
    A Canadian from Cole Harbour, Canada writes: Vern McPherson from writes: Who is Glen P Robbins ???
    You are a smart guy and I gave you a link to the web site. I will let you do your own research.
    Have a nice day
    Posted 08/08/08 at 6:22 AM EDT | Alert an Editor | Link to Comment

    ----===================================

    dufus, there is nada on the site about the person who owns the thingy. N A D A !!!

    Is Glen afraid of publishing a bio at least ?

    Google also has nada. Who is he ??
  57. Vern McPherson from writes:
    Looks like a glenn whatzizname poll is worth about as much as lead paint in a dull needle at a tatoo joint ............

    Oh the numbers are close - if you happen to be a COns ...... LOL !!!!

    Let me guess........ he's affilliated with the Fraser Institute ????

    Poll supplied by glen whatzizname. .......

    Respondents provided by Doug Finley ..........
  58. A Canadian from Cole Harbour, Canada writes: Vern I am afraid the only one that has proven himself to be a 'Dufus' is you .

    Have a nice day and try to relax a litle. Life is too short
  59. A Canadian from Cole Harbour, Canada writes: Cameron M from Toronto, Canada writes: Military officer in N.B. charged with child pornography offences The GAM doesn't think this is newsworthy

    --------

    For what its worth. It is reported on CNN that Canada announced Wednesday that it will dispatch a warship to Somalia's coast to protect U.N. aid ships from pirate attacks. It was on CTV news but I dont see it being reported either on G@M but it made it to CNN.
    The World Food Programme rep said on TV that it was the best thing to happened and was greatly appreciative of Canada contribution.

    Here are a few links from National and international news.

    http://www.cbc.ca/cp/national/080806/n080648A.html

    http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/americas/08/06/somalia.piracy/index.html

    http://www.gedonet.com/index.php?news=3479

    http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=65854§ionid=351020701

    No doubt the usual 'Dufus' will find something negative to say about this.

    As for that military officer, he is being charged not found guilty yet . Once found guilty then it is news.
  60. Carl Hansen from Canada writes: Dion never forced those people to sign a mortgage Michael.
    I wonder why Winnipeg isn't on the list. Talk about over-priced.
  61. haji georges from Canada writes: It Must be Harpers fault
  62. haji georges from Canada writes: Liberals today are so far left they could soon be touching the right side ,,,,,unreal posts on here by some.If I was running in office I wouldnt want your vote ,you would be an embarrassment
  63. Dave C from Canada writes: 10%, yeah right! Values went up 100% over 2 years all based on speculators and an overheated but unsustainable in the long run economy. They have already dropped over 10% in the West and there is allot more room for them to go down considerably farther. Much farther than 10%. The house flippers who were willing to pay the absurd prices are now in trouble and stuck with their 'investments', the majority of the real legitimate buyers just flat out refuse to pay anything close to what is being asked. The result is prices will drop and drop hard!
  64. Dropped Acid - Climate change is a socialist conspriacy (I don't think...) from Canada writes: .

    Why isn't Toronto mentioned in this negative article about Western Canada?????

    This is tantamount to the NEP!

    The globe is soooooo partisan it's not even funny anymore!!!

    Toronto is like evil because a lot of people live there - this is why Toronto is evil.
  65. haji georges from Canada writes: Just another adjustment period for canadians,70s,80,and 90s were no different,the real question is did any of us who lived through the last couple learn anything?
  66. Dave C from Canada writes: 'd p from writes: Does anybody have a link to the actual report?

    I also think prices got a bit out of hand. But in Canada we had real reasons for the increase in house prices... the price of oil, lots of jobs and a healthy economy. It was not just a liquidity influenced boom like the U.S.

    House prices in Alberta have peaked, but problems in the Middle East could lead back to higher oil prices. Somebody starts shooting, the price of oil goes back above $130 for a long period of time, and Alberta real estate prices could claw back some recent declines.

    Alberta can be boom or bust, its not a game for the weak or undercapitalized.'

    The Alberta economy has much less to do with Oil jobs and almost everything to do with construction jobs. Realistically how many people in Alberta work in the oil industry? Very few compared to the whole population. Alberta has been running on a massive construction sugar hit. All fueled by the hundreds of thousands of people who moved here in such a short period. They came here in search of the infamous well paying oil jobs that in reality, just don't exist in the cities. They stayed and worked in construction. Massive residential and commercial construction has fueled the economy and the economic spin offs to other businesses have been enormous. Unfortunately though, when construction slows, and it is happening already, you will see the economy slow considerably.

    This will happen regardless if oil is 100 or 200 dollars. BTW, US housing crashed in the face of very low unemployment. People were not going into foreclosure because they lost their jobs, they just overextended themselves and it caught up to them, just as it will in Western Canada.
  67. j adams from Winnipeg, Canada writes: It was going to happen sooner or later. I'm glad I bought my house before the market went crazy. I feel for a lot of people who overpaid. Last year a friend of mine paid 60% more than I did for a house a little more than half the size of mine. Batten down the hatches and good luck.
  68. summom bonum from Canada writes:

    Michael Sharp.

    Thanks for the laughs.

    It's great to laugh at something witty and funny rather than at the pitiful antics of some of the more unintentional comics posting herein.

    I also appreciate the time you spend defending regular Canadian's interests against the inanities spouted by the usual suspects in their neverending quest to dictate how we live as we pay for the privilege.

    Liberal Canada. Cui bono.
  69. D G from Canada writes: I see this thread was infected immediately by MS as well.
  70. Was Canadian from New York, United States writes: “It's quiet on the buyers' side. Listings are up, sales are down,” said Ken Glauser, associate broker at Henry Moulin Realty Inc. “Surprisingly, the overall average price isn't down though.”

    The classic stand-off. Buyers feeling their oats are not going to pay; sellers feeling the pinch are in denial that the free money is no more.
  71. Dropped Acid - Climate change is a socialist conspriacy (I don't think...) from Canada writes: .

    Remember last summer around this time when Harper and Bush were meeting in Quebec and we conservatives has three police officers pretend they were protesters in an effort to delegitimize real protesters who were practicing their democratic right to do so?

    Remember that? That was sooo funny! We conservatives have nothing but contempt for democracy. As a staunch conservative I can guarantee you that our party, given a majority, will undermine all democratic institutions like our brothers in the US have.

    We are conservatives, and we hate you.
  72. sur. kai from london, United Kingdom writes: Does it sound like 1926 recession? Or not yet.
  73. Panty in a knot from vancouver, Canada writes: HELP ME. HELP ME.

    Lasf fall the bank loaned me $850,000 for my $900,000 1200 sq.ft. condo even though I work as a bartender. Another bank even gave me a home equity line thinking that the price of my condo went up and then I went out and bought a BMW X5.

    Now tips are starting to dry up at the bar and I can't pay my mortgage payment. The bank promised I could always refinance by neighbour just sold the same size condo for $800,000 and the bank won't give me any more money.

    Sound Absurd? Think Again. Its everywhere here.
  74. summom bonum from Canada writes: The partially appropriate moniker, Dropped Acid says: ' As a staunch conservative I can guarantee you that our party, given a majority, will undermine all democratic institutions like our brothers in the US have.' Will we also get to have a Judge pronounce our undermining of Democracy for all to hear? Will we get to have a Judge pronounce how we had an illegal kickback scheme that may have caused 3 unfair National Elections? Will we have to let the Judge ignore certain leaders and issues? Will we be able to fine ourselves for our guilt? Pick the amount of the fine? Ensure no party member takes responsibility? Give a disgraceful 2 year performance to try and bring the other Party down to our documented level of corruption . Demonize Americans, Albertans, Westerners, Conservatives, Quebecois, rural Canadians, Christians, old people? Who's next? Act like the Federal govt belongs to us and take a 2 year tantrum for the voters temerity? Have our actions make the even horrible NDP look good by comparison? Have no Leader, no money, no cohesion, no sane policies, no principles and still feel entitled? Are we all not entitled to our entitlements? Is that in the Constitution?
  75. Steven Murray from Victoria, Canada writes: For those who seem to think this article is some kind of G&M conspiracy against Western Canada, the reason a slump in housing prices isn't predicted for Toronto is because, relatively speaking, housing is not overpriced there. For example, the latest stats from the Cdn. Real Estate Association shows that average selling prices in Victoria are 20% higher than those in Toronto, and prices in Vancouver are more than 50% higher than Toronto prices.
  76. Greg Out West from Canada writes: D G from Canada writes: I see this thread was infected immediately by MS as well.
    ----------------------------------------------
    D G, when I read Michael's posts the first thing that becomes apparent is that he has at a minimum, basis average intellegence. Canada has finnally been pulled into the current world recession, unempolyment is up, inflation is up, housing values are down, the number of people living in povety is up, more and more people are living from pay check to pay check and you think dion's going to win an election on increasing the price of every single thing Canadians buy ? He's 100 percent right. You'd have to be as thick as a brick to buy into that logic. Sorry no offence intended but even liberals can see dion's off his rocker. The only good news for the LPC is that they will be able to replace him with someone a little more in tune with the average Canadian.
  77. The Globe and Mail editors censor free speech from Canada writes: You mean that these cities couldn't maintain their 20-50% housing price increases year over year? Who could have seen that coming?
  78. Jay G from Ottawa, Canada writes: Leave it to Bill K to quote Garth Turner. I don't understand why people consider Turner even remotely credible. Have a read for yourself - this article outlines all of Turner's predictions from 1999. They had me giggling like a little school-girl.

    http://stockbullz.com/What-Garth-Turner-Wrote-In-1999

    I think Turner was referring to Bill K when he named his book 'greater fool'
  79. Peter Simpson from Vancouver, Canada writes: Interesting that two Toronto based economists find Toronto is not over valued but everything west of Toronto is. Essentially their houses have held their value but nobody else is that fortunate.
  80. Inmate #18330-424 from Coleman Federal Prison, United States writes: Albertans are lucky their provincial government looked ahead, past the boom times, and planned for the future by saving and investing ...

    Ooops. Never mind.

  81. Joe Dick from Kingston, Canada writes: This must be Harpers fault.

    Damn you HARRRPERRRR!!!!
  82. Dropped Acid - Climate change is a socialist conspriacy (I don't think...) from Canada writes: Peter Simpson from Vancouver, Canada writes: Interesting that two Toronto based economists find Toronto is not over valued but everything west of Toronto is. Essentially their houses have held their value but nobody else is that fortunate.

    -------------------------

    Yes, I agree, this is truly interesting.

    These two Toronto Latte drinking devils control the actual value of what people sell and pay for houses out west. They are indeed that powerful and must be stopped at all costs. This is just another part of the conspiracy to suppress the west.
  83. Dropped Acid - Climate change is a socialist conspriacy (I don't think...) from Canada writes: The Globe and Mail editors censor free speech from Canada writes: You mean that these cities couldn't maintain their 20-50% housing price increases year over year? Who could have seen that coming?

    ---------------------

    Apparently no one out west did.

    I blame Trudeau and David Suzuki for that. Their conspiracies to socialize everything and transfer Ft. McMurray money to New Brunswick day care centres is part of the problem.
  84. Dropped Acid - Climate change is a socialist conspriacy (I don't think...) from Canada writes: sur. kai from london, United Kingdom writes: Does it sound like 1926 recession? Or not yet.

    --------------------

    Give us more time. We conservatives have finally gotten rid of that pesky surplus, now we're working towards creating a deficit (our grand poo-bah Mulroney showed us the way with his record 43 billion deficit), and soon we'll come after the values of your houses.

    Why? Because we're conservative and everything else is evil and socialist and like it must be stopped because like we're conservative and we hate reality and facts and other useless things.
  85. Dropped Acid - Climate change is a socialist conspriacy (I don't think...) from Canada writes: Billy Talon from Toronto, Canada writes:I knew Sharp, the G & M class clown, would make an appearance.

    Great job - you made everyone on here laugh.

    Keep up the good work, you partisan monkey.

    ----------------------------

    Shame on you Billy for such derogatory remarks!!!

    Sharpie is not a partisan monkey, he's simply representing the conservative party and what we truly think of everything. I find Sharp's complete dumbarse take on everything to truly get at the heart of what it means to be a conservative.

    We conservatives hate everything, so why not simply make crap up and pass it off as fact like brother Sharp has? Is this not right??
  86. Michael Sharp from Victoria, Canada writes:

    I may be dumbarse but I don't live in Toronto.
    I may be dumbarse but at least I don't believe in taxing everything when money is tight.
    I may be dumbarse but I don't believe day care reduces GHGs.

    I may be a partisan monkey but at least I'm my own partisan monkey.

    I may be making stuff up (never happened) but if you believe the Green Shift hasn't hit the fan you're even dumbarser than me.
  87. Angry Calgarian from Calgary, Canada writes: I came on to see if there were any intelligent insights to be shared by my fellow readers. Instead I've read mostly insipid name-calling, partisan pollitical posturing, and a display of general bad-manners.

    To those who have posted something relevant to the story, thank you. As a one day hopeful home buyer in Calgary, I look to these comments for some alternate viewpoints to the G&M perspective.
  88. Michael Sharp from Victoria, Canada writes:

    OK.
    Let's keep it completely on topic.

    Dot com bubble.
    Real estate bubble.

    End of thread.
  89. Pacific Volcano from Ottawa, Canada writes: In Ontario, when the MPAC send out the new property assessment, after 2-3 year of freeze, reflects the top of the market, expect to see a double-digit hikes in property taxes in many municipalities. so much of home value increase to the home owner.
  90. Hound Dog from Canada, Canada writes: The Globe and Mail has an issue with the quality of data being reported.

    The first article published yesterday offered this information:

    “Mr. Wolf is most concerned about Saskatchewan, where the doubling of house prices in Regina and Saskatoon over the past two years 'has led us to estimate that these markets are now close to 50 per cent overvalued.'

    In B.C., Vancouver's and Victoria's housing markets are now up to 35 per cent overvalued, he estimates.”

    Today’s published report offers this information:

    “Markets in Regina, Saskatoon, Vancouver, Victoria, Calgary, Edmonton, Sudbury and Montreal are all more than 10 per cent overvalued, as calculated by economists David Wolf and Carolyn Kwan.”

    What happened in two days to change the data and information by so much?
  91. J Hare from Saskatoon, Canada writes: Finally some good news. Prices here are terribly over valued though no one wants to say so. This is a 300,000 person city with most rents starting at $800 plus utilities or $1000 with (note this is starting). Average house hold income is 60,000 and average personal income is 36,000. Again this is average so 50% of people earn less the 36,000 per year and half of households earn less then 60,000 per year. The average house price in Saskatoon in nearly 300,000 with most comming in at 280,000 (check MLS). That means it takes one full years sallary to put a 10% down payment on a house here. If you earn 30,000 per year then take away 12,000 for rent then you can at most save 18,000 per year if you didn't have to eat or consume any other income. I'm waiting to see prices drop significantly here. Again, finally.

    James Hare
  92. Carrie Hull from Toronto, Canada writes: Angry Calgarian: Yes, it would be nice to see intelligent, informed discussion on the website of the Globe and Mail. Sadly, you will find many of the discussions here are just like this one.

    My 2 cents: I think it's interesting that most analysts are just now predicting a downturn, once it has actually started. They have to say something or they will look like idiots in the next few months. They can get away with saying it won't happen in Toronto for a short while longer.
  93. Darcy Meyer from Canada writes: Natural pull back. The level of pullback out west will be largely directed by global resource price strength, and given a global slowdown those are under downward pressure. I think it will slow (correct) through the fall and into next winter but will turn around by next spring once the US starts to pull out of recession and commodity demand resumes upward pressure.
  94. Elmo Harris from Niagara, Canada writes: Conservative times are hard times. Always has been. Always will be.

    How's that trickle down effect of lowering taxes working so far? Never worked. Never will.

    Canada always goes broke on a Conservative watch.
  95. Billy Talon from Toronto, Canada writes: Michael Sharp from Victoria, Canada writes:

    I may be dumbarse but I don't live in Toronto.
    I may be dumbarse but at least I don't believe in taxing everything when money is tight.
    I may be dumbarse but I don't believe day care reduces GHGs.

    I may be a partisan monkey but at least I'm my own partisan monkey.

    I may be making stuff up (never happened) but if you believe the Green Shift hasn't hit the fan you're even dumbarser than me.

    ***

    I assume you are refering to me.

    I love Toronto - so I could care less if you don't like the city or people. That's your problem, not mine.

    Your constant criticism of Toronto, instead of coming off as intelligent or thought provoking, instead make you very petty and insecure.

    As for your other points, no where did I say in my posts I support Dion or his 'Green Plan'.

    You are a partisan monkey - the fact that you are proud of it further reinforces my thoughts about you and your juvenile posts.
  96. summom bonum from Canada writes: Ontario Provincial Debt as of May 31, 2008= C$164.0 billion
    (isn't that double what it was when Harris left office?)

    Alberta Provincial Debt as of May 31,2008= C$0.00

    Heritage Fund as of May 31,2008= C$ 17 Billion

    Numbers easy enough for even a Liberal voting Ontarian to understand. Or not.

  97. Joe Black from Canada writes: Agree with Mr. Hare. Rents are ridiculous in Saskatoon right now. Ironically we have a big labour shortage problem in the service and construction industries, but its difficult for those workers to survive here because theres nowhere affordable for them to live. The hard working people on the bottom are the ones who have been getting shafted.
  98. Greg Out West from Canada writes: Elmo Harris from Niagara, Canada writes: Conservative times are hard times. Always has been. Always will be.

    How's that trickle down effect of lowering taxes working so far? Never worked. Never will.

    Canada always goes broke on a Conservative watch.
    -------------------------------------------------------
    Elmo, I don't disagree but with everything there has to be a balance. The trick is to find that balance. Under tax and you hurt basic social programs. Over tax and you leave the government open to corruption and manipulation. This goes for all government parties.
  99. summom bonum from Canada writes: Taxes are invariably the largest number in every Canadians list of outgoing expenses. Must be all those politicians and bureaucrats staying at the Economy Lodge Motel.
  100. J Hare from Saskatoon, Canada writes: Darcy Meyer, not entirely true. As Calgary is the hub of resoure companies and Sask is just 5 hours away by car (to Stoon) it is unlikely that they will open much more then a front location in Sask for resource extraction. The number of people employed will vary but much of the wealth generated tends to stay in the location of the mines (check out the prices for things in Fort McMurray) and some does trickle out into the wider economy. I'm not certain Stoon will see the large increase in wealth Calgary did. It hasn't yet anyway. While the population of Stoon has increased in the past, we did just experinece a drop of 2,000 people a month ago mostly leaving because the city is becoming unaffordable.

    James Hare
  101. Greg Out West from Canada writes: summom bonum from Canada writes: Ontario Provincial Debt as of May 31, 2008= C$164.0 billion
    (isn't that double what it was when Harris left office?)

    Alberta Provincial Debt as of May 31,2008= C$0.00

    Heritage Fund as of May 31,2008= C$ 17 Billion

    Numbers easy enough for even a Liberal voting Ontarian to understand. Or not.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    summom bonum, I agree this looks great for Alberta I hope that the provincial government will start putting more of and future surpluses into the fund. As we're seeing today the good times don't always last.
  102. Michael Sharp from Victoria, Canada writes:

    Billy Talon from Toronto?

    I love you, man.
  103. Darcy Meyer from Canada writes: J Hare